https://www.sthelensstar.co.uk/sport/19 ... by-league/ I read this with some interest until Shane Richardson actually made a proposal which was[i "to have a 10-team competition based on the needs of television",[/i which he feels should include "Newcastle and Wales and two overseas teams, mostly likely from France". The man is an utter genius.............

https://www.sthelensstar.co.uk/sport/19 ... by-league/ I read this with some interest until Shane Richardson actually made a proposal which was[i "to have a 10-team competition based on the needs of television",[/i which he feels should include "Newcastle and Wales and two overseas teams, mostly likely from France". The man is an utter genius.............

Since when have you suggested/agreed with 2 French clubs.

How about a link with the ideas of chairman Lenagan - or was this just another time when he had a private conversation with you?

He was a good CEO at Hull so im always open to listen to his ideas. He is definitely right that SL needs an independent board not just chairmen voting to suit themselves and he is right that we face extinction the way things are going.

10 teams is too small, but I'd agree with his suggestions of Newcastle as it is a large City with a good Rugby ground and there are definitely green shoots of interest up there. I also think we gave up on Wrexham too quickly, North Wales can be seen as an extension to the heartlands and there isn't much sport in competition up there. We also badly need a Cumbrian team, create a merged one and get on with it. Id also bring Bradford back.

Instead of creating a wish list of teams I'd like to see in SL, I thought I'd do one of what teams are underperforming and dragging SL down.

Huddersfield - rich RL fanatic owner, great stadium, birthplace of the game but despite cheap season tickets and success on the field earlier in the decade the crowds stubbornly refuse to increase, the Town isn't interested.

Salford - loyal fan base, an unexpected Grand Final and CC final (but that burst of success seems to be over) decent stadium but poorly located and that has hit crowds, Salford as a City is in the shadow of Manchester and limits the appeal.

Wakefield - again a loyal fan base and always punch above their weight on the field with the budget...but how many decades have to go by where we are promised a new stadium or ground improvements and nothing happens?

Cas - same as Wakefield above but a smaller town where even with a new ground there would be a natural limit to crowds

HullKR - of course I am biased here...but loyal fan base, to their credit ground has been gradually improved and they help create at least 2 good attendances a year with the Derby, but East Hull is geographically isolated so again there's a natural limit to how big their crowds can go. 2 teams in one isolated City isn't ideal either.

For balance the other clubs aren't running a perfect ship: Wigan's crowd decline this decade doesn't get highlighted enough, constant success and a team filled with local youngsters but the crowds are staying away?? Hull have serious issues with their stadium deal. Really there's only Leeds, Saints, Warrington and Catalan in a good place with rich owners, their own ground and good fan bases.

Places in a league should be based on performances on the field that indicates the health and status of a club finance and followers go along with this.Just picking out a city an saying it could be a rugby league city has been proved not to work. We seem to constantly knock heartland clubs who compete and bring through players year on year. We just seem to be looking for sticking plaster solutions. In the face of a pandemic we need to just get fans back through the gates as soon as we are allowed and give them a great match day experience. If Newcastle are to be a SL team it will happen with time.Bigger question than new locations should be focusing on getting fans back through the gates at existing clubs. Debate is do we stick with set up or go 10 and 10 or 14 SL clubs thus makes the poss of Toulouse or Newcastle getting in SL greater.

Two leagues of 10 could work but the big factor is are SKY up for showing 1 game a week from SL2? If the gap in funds is reduced between the two leagues teams yo-yoing about between the two leagues wouldent be as bad, at the moment it is too boom or bust.

As things stand two leagues of 10 looks competitive and has a good geographical spread. Arguments could be made to include Newcastle and Barrow in SL2 due to the potential and on field performances respectively.

Catalans
Saints
Wigan
Warrington
HullFC
HullKR
Cas
Leeds
Wakefield
Toulouse

Huddersfield
Salford
Leigh
Fev
Batley
Bradford
London
Halifax
Widnes
York

You could easily have 2 leagues of 10 full time should it appeal to the broadcasters. Have a third league set up but they must hit certain criteria to be eligible to move to SL2. Play each other twice with one magic round each, could cover the loss of home games by intoducing a group stage in the challenge cup.

The game for far too long has year by year watered down the top games to the point even the local derbies dont sell out due to being over used. Less is more and all that. Would give clubs a proper pre season to improve players which puts a better product on the field. Overburn and same old fixtures have contributed to many walking away from the sport IMO.

The trouble is we have changed our structure and got it wrong far too often for people to even take our game seriousley. Put something in place and let it grow.

Completely agree, they have overused Derby games and fixtures such as Wigan-Warrington. Two games against each team plus a Magic weekend is about right. The rest of the calander to be filled with a proper international schedule. I also thought a later start to the season worked well this year, better weather and fans not as skint as they are straight after Xmas.

Not so sure Catalans own their own ground, hence the council swimming baths, was assured over there that the mayor of Perpignan who was also the chairman of the RU club that they built the baths to stop the dragons ever having a better ground than them, believe what you will there, as for the rhinos, with the money they borrowed for ground improvements I think it will be a long time before they actually own their half of the ground, other than that I don't think your far off.

Do they" walk away" or do they just watch the third fixture on SKY Television? This being he point, the structure has to maximise the appeal to TV viewers?

Does showing a third Wigan.v.Saints fixture pull in more TV viewers than a first showing of Featherstone.v.Toulouse.......

SKY want bums on TV seats.....

The less you deliver SKY the less clubs we can support as professional outfits?

Its too late now. The game will be semi pro in 5 years.

You only need to look at the cost cutting going on at St Helens and Wigan as evidence of that. Both clubs are preparing for it

The big point in his article is "fixing" the current situation in a 2 year time frame (before the next TV deal).
The game is on it's booty and he's certainly right about the "International" debacle on Friday.

RL is run so very, very badly and it certainly needs to get a grip of itself.

To "save" the sport, I would go for a return to "franchising", which should at least protect super league.
However, the rest of the sport is in serious peril, right down to community clubs and RL in schools - worrying times.

Do you think that the cost cutting is more to do with having their income slashed over the last 18 months ??
For clubs who would usually attract 15,000 fans to their games, who would buy, merchandise, foo / drink, lottery tickets etc, etc, to then have 4000 fans rolling up and not to be able to sell drinks and restricted opportunities to sell merchandise.
It's not difficult to see why they and every other club, are having to cut costs.
IF we can get back to meaningful crowds etc, things will begin to turn, in the short term.

However, the games failings go back to long before covid, it's just that there are now laid bare for all to see.
The mis season "test" was just one example of the mickey mouse administration that runs our sport.

The just protect Super League attitude is not good enough without the championship and community clubs and academies the whole sport will decline through lack of participation. We need a whole game plan. Not a just looking after the SL clubs.

You are correct that clubs have lost a lot of additional spending with games behind closed doors, a lot of merchandise sales are stuff like scarves that people only buy to wear at games in cold weather, then vests in summer etc. You can only do so much marketing to sell these online.

And yes Covid has just exposed long running problems in the game, its been mismanaged for at least a decade. We've gone from giving away the title sponsorship for free, to constantly changing the format, to hyping Toronto up then cutting them off...loyal fans of the game are fed up.

“One idea from Richardson is to have a 10-team competition based on the needs of television, which he feels should include Newcastle and Wales and two overseas teams, mostly likely from France.”
So who would be the other six teams? Probably Wigan, Saints, Leeds, Hull, London + 1 other.
In my opinion that’s an absolute nailed on certainty for the complete extinction of British rugby league within ten years. We should be working on a strategy to protect and grow the clubs we already have. We talk about the RL heartland but we neglect it and it’s withering. I don’t now what the strategy should be but I do know that the biggest tree needs strong roots and a clear pathway from those roots to the very top! (Whoops, I seem to have gone all Eric Cantona)

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough in my previous post.
Of course, we need a plan for all of the game from bottom to top, from kids right up to SL and the International game, something that has been lacking since Adam was a young boy.
However, in the context of the article, in which Richardson suggests that we need a sort out before the next SL TV deal, it's time for the clubs and broadcasters to decide, exactly what everyone wants to progress the sport.
The damage that the Toronto episode has done is huge and once again shown the sport in a bad light.
I know that there were huge unforeseen and unavoidable issues with covid but, Toronto were already a busted flush and for them not to complete the season was poor form.
Equally, the promotion of Leigh, to make the numbers up, was less than ideal and with them following Toronto's SL form, without a victory in the top flight, it's probably time to pull up the drawbridge and try and ensure that SL is the strongest that it can be. After all, this is the flagship competition for pro RL in the UK (and Europe).
Yes, there needs to be work done on the lower leagues too, who are equally affected with covid issues, although, for the most part, supporter numbers are not affected and they can still largely achieve the same crowds as 18 months ago.

The one certainty is that even within the RL world, we look like a half baked badly organised sport and for those outside the sport, this must be multiplied by 10, not great when we are so short of investment.
Who in their right minds would want to be associated with such a shambolic organisation ?

Somebody needs to get a grip and fast !

Not sure but I presume that Davey, Carter, Fulton, Quash, Beaumont, Hudgill, and him at Salford might have other ideas, Lenaghan and Pearson might make the biggest noise, but I can't see the other chairmen agreeing to what you rightly describe as an absolute certainty of the complete and utter extinction of of the game in this country.

That's too extreme, but the point is a valid one.

'Fixing' RL is easiest than it seems, you just need a competent RFL and decisions able to be made about SL and it's future without the clubs having an influence. As McManus said about the Toronto decision, this isn't a decision SL clubs should be making, it's one where the overall direction and governance of the sport needs to come first, before the immediate needs of the current clubs.

1 - Remove the existing RFL management
2 - Remove the power of the SL clubs in decision making within SL, this has to happen
3 - Have RL played at schools across the country. Schools are crying out for community involvement and help. Get into the schools and get them playing. It doesn't have to be crazy expensive either, have a few employed development officers and involve univerisities and colleges who will have tons of students looking to get into sports organisation, coaching and marketing etc. You provide schools with kit, equipment and a competition to play in and a bit of attention and they'll lap it up. In the traditional areas the community clubs can be invited in once a term etc, run sessions and maximise their own intake of players.
4 - Have involvement from the RFL and SL at all the community clubs. Some do this really well, others need to improve. It doesn't need to cost much.
5 - Disband SL academies and bring back town teams, with those outside joining their nearest setup, plus regional setups in areas the game hasn't got pro clubs in. Free up the cash spent on SL clubs signing players from all over the country and invest it in employing a coach part time to properly coach a town team. Pro clubs then get them at 17 and community clubs get tons more coming through rather than just a handful as it is now.
6 - Have a 2 tier SL. We've been crying out for this since franchising began. Some clubs did fine, complied with the regulations and had grounds, teams and infrastructures suitable. The Yorkshire clubs bar Hull and Leeds didn't and still don't. There is no shame in it. Actively invite applications from investors for clubs willing to invest in the game. Sell the game to the NRL or he likes of Hearn if needed, just get some money on board from somewhere. There really isn't a downside to it, as whoever buys in will want a return and to grow it, not let it wither. Get big city teams and money involved and the TV deal will flourish. And don't obsess if they fail, just ensure there's another to replace them. Some will be successful.

The sport has been in a malaise for years now, just happy to exist and not doing anything to grow or thrive. Number 1 and 2 on the list are vital, if we don't do that they might as well fold SL and go back to semi pro now while the clubs still exist.

Tinkering with the clubs at the top of the game won't make any difference and if it's not careful Richardson's plan could alienate large swathes of supporters for no gain at all.

The game needs to address a lack of participation from the grass roots upwards. Without that there is no game. The numbers of players and supporters is dwindling massively and there seems to be no plan to do anything about it.

That would help address the issue of dwindling corporate interest as no company is going to want to sponsor a sport played by a tiny minority of people.

It's all very well posters on here listing who they'd get rid of or keep but the fundamental issue affects us all - there are too few people playing and watching RL.

I would suggest that both, in fact all aspects of the game are important.
Without numbers at the bottom (kids and the community game), there will be no semi pro or pro sport.

It does appear though, that, with less money coming in at the top, there does need to be some "streamlining" of SL and The Championship.

Equally, probably more work needs doing to re-engage kids with RL.
There certainly seems to be a reluctance from all schools to participate in contact sports and whilst some kids will still go along to their local club, lack of RL in schools would be a massive blow for the sport, absolutely massive.

When will the sport realise that the quick fix changes wont work. You can't parachute a club into an area playing a sport no one has interest in and expect it to thrive instantly. The same as you can't say club A has attendance of 5k and club B has attendance of 5k lets merge and we'll instantly get an attendance of 10k, you wont, you'll get a fan base with no buy in to the club at hand. Have we learned nothing from Gateshead, Sheffield, Paris and Toronto.

If a sport as big as NFL and the NBA can't get a decent league set up in this country then RL has no chance.
This sport needs to realise that its a minority sport, RU has womn the war and we need to size and shape ourselves around that principle, alienating half the current support base will do nothing but bring on the demise quicker. ,
Lets focus on what we're good at, strong local rivalries, forge better links with the NRL and market the product we have, stop dreaming of matching international RU and build from grass roots, organically grow in areas we want to expand in but dont burn the upper echelons to do it.
RL is the king of the bad idea and throwing out babies with bathwater

Spot on. We seem far too obsessed with trying to compete with the NRL and RU we just make bad decision after bad decision because they knee jerk too often. Covid aside there has being far too many structure changes and not alot of
f time for growth.

Get a structure, back it and concerntrate on building from the bottom up. We will never beat football or rugby union in terms of popularity but we can certainley do alot better then we certainley are doing.

Those calling for 'more local rivalries' etc just think about their team and their team only. They don't want franchising as their team might not be invited.

The sport is fantastic. In competent hands, free of the self interest of the clubs, the sport could grow significantly.

Having no ambition and suggesting RL should accept and love being played in the M62 corridor on a semi-pro basis isn't good enough. In the modern world it'll disappear completely. Start at the bottom, get into the schools, get the grassroots junior clubs thriving again. Sell the game to investors or Hearn or the NRL and improve the money in the top end of the game. Do both and there is no reason we can't have average crowds over 10,000 and record numbers watching and playing the game. It just takes a bit of investment, enthusiasm and competent management. Neither the RFL nor Super League has any of that, hence the need to sell both the competition and it's control to someone who will seek to grow it.