Well, just in case you hadn't heard yet, the Kiwis have just won their 3rd major title in 6 years, making them the most successful international side in the world at the moment. This off the back of only one team in the NRL. There are tons of Kiwis spread across the NRL at the moment in Aussie clubs (and they say British clubs have too many imports?!).

Surely this hotbed of RL needs a second NRL team? There must be an appetite for it somewhere. It would do wonders for the international game (creating more diehard league fans around NZ that will no doubt attend international games) as well as no doubt breed a lot more talented players not only for NZ, but for the Pacific Island nations (you know, the ones that are Kiwis until they stopped getting picked!). As daft as that sounds, it would most likely be the case that you'd see them improve because of the slack international eligibility laws, which can only be a bonus to the international game.

What ever happened to the Southern Orcas bid? It seems to have gone very quiet (weren't they even applying to play in the Super League at one point?!). The PNG bid seems to be making more noise than them at the moment. I just think it's a bit of a shame that we could be missing out on probably the best ever chance to expand the game in NZ whilst it's probably at the most popular level it's ever been at over there. At the same time though, the other bids in CC and Perth are very good. Would be amazing if we could fit them all in!

What about moving the Warriors to Eden Park, and establishing that as the base for Rugby in NZ. Then, change NZ Warriors to Warriors and Create a Wellington based team, playing at the Jade or Westpac.

2013 is a foregone conclusion the CC and WA bid's are to far advanced to not be included into the NRL.
So the NZRL should be looking at getting a bid out Canterbury NZ underway for 2017 - do what the Titans did and the Bears are doing by just continually letting the NRL know that you want in. Get a crapload of Business Support and the community behind the bid.
Why I said them not Wellington is simple really - they would really only have one team to compete against (in terms of sponsership) and that's the Canterbury Crusaders. Now if they got in imagine the rivalry between the North island getting behind the Warriors and the South Island behind the team out of Canterbury (NZ)

2018, Southern whatevers. 9 games in Wellington and 3 in Christchurch. In the next 6 years until then get at least 3 NRL games played in each city per year, fund the NZRL to set up strong jnr programmes in each city, get a NSW cup side in from Wellington, more Int's in each city, SOO for NZ Sth V Nth.

Problem with NRL, unlike AFL, is it does zero prep work for introduction of new teams and is just reactive to whatever bids come along instead of having a long term vision and being proactive to make it happen.

Not a lot....the NZRL needed to sort out it's own house and has tried to....there is still one sticking point out of Auckland....but the national comp went well and the finals were televised on Sky......the next step will be the running of the comp next year with a higher profile....ie....backing and spending by the NZRL.
After that, it is an investment issue.....wellington council/corporation won't be financially backing a bid and the stadium trust for the cake tin will want paying for games up front...so it will need a benefactor who believes in League to get the bid to a break even stage.
I would agree that a 'split" franchise, between Wellington and Christchurch is the way to go....but not until the money is there for a 5 year plan.
Other sports in the wellington region have seen a drop in attendances.....and although the Kiwis got 21k for the England game......international sport against the POME team is not the same as a season ticket.....5 years money minimum needed to build something up.

Wellington average over 20,000 for NRL games.

We'll let them in soon. But not next round of expansion.

We'll get back to you when we are ready...

don't leave it too late......the NZRL comp may be of a better standard than the NRL sooner than you think

That comment speaks volumes for your understanding of either country in rugby league.

lol

As I said, see you next round.

in 2013 the nrl is adding central coast bears and perth reds to the comp.

so 2018 would be the next expansion window and wellington and ipswich would then be favourites

the scary thing about the nrl is how many places are begging for a team

at least 20 - 22 teams is what we should aim for

22 is what I think in years to come. And ideally like the NFL each team play's each other once a regular season therefore making the club games more of an occasion when they play each other.

will take significant increase in income by the NRL to afford 22 teams. Ideally the grant from the NRL would be in the $6-7million a club now. To get to 22 teams and fund them properly it would take at least a doubling of income on the NRL's part. Still a long way to go till we see that.

When someone has tens of millions of dollars going spare to market a club to an interested public outside Auckland. Very easily doable as soon as you have a mad butcher but on a much larger scale in terms of finances

Good old butcher.

not going to happen but my dream :

2013 - central coast and perth
2018 - ipswitch and wellington
2023 - png & adelaide
2028 - christchurch and PI team (tonga,samoa and fiji)

ie 24 teams

broken up into 2 conferences, one being the nsw teams and the other the expansion teams

each team plays home and away in each division (12 teams each, 22 rounds)

then have a top 5 finals systems for each division

winners of each division go to the grand final.

by being able to expand every 5 years thats going to increase future TV deals a lot, ignoring inflation on the existing viewers

in australia potentially we can add the following viewers - FTA / Pay TV

WA - 150,000 / 50,000
Adelaide - 100,000 / 25,000
Melbourne - 150,000 / 50,000
Queensland - 250,000 / 100,000

Despite having some knowledge of NZ and Wellington in particular I dont have enough understanding of the sport down there to offer a reasoned opinion

Maybe some from down there should consider the same before telling us ' up ' here how our sport should progress in the future

Certainly, the next round should be Perth and Central Coast. Bringing the Bears back into the competition will bring fans from Mosman and Willoughby north.

Perth is a no brainer to extend the TV profile and we have the runs on the board from the late 1980s/1990s prior to the SLW. And again with the executed Reds.

Are there enough quality players to maintain the high intensity of the NRL with so many teams?

3 years ago, but knowing the luvvly NRL, it will take them 10 years minimum.

WOAH WOAH WOAH Dally.

You spent AGES telling JB that Perth had absolutely no chance!
What changed your tune...

Ok....I have only been in Wellington for 12 months, but after watching the Local comp, the national Comp and wall to wall NRL/Toyota cup on SKY, I would offer this as an explanation as to why NZRL will concentrate on getting its own house in order before pressing for another NRL team. I may be well of the mark with cetain assumptions, but it is mainly based on published facts:
NZRL has been in disarray for many years, with national comps failing and regions working to their own agendas. It was one of the reasons that Bluey left after he had won the RLWC........ In July 2009 Jim Doyle was appointed CEO. His first task was to investigate and assess the organisation from top to bottom and in September 2009 he published his framework document for the future of the game in NZ. This can be read [url=http://www.nzrl.co.nz/pdf/more-than-just-a-game.pdfHERE[/url (warning. 9 meg)
The new 7 Regions are all now in place with only one area currently causing problems and new competitions successfully launched at senior and under age levels in 2010. The next steps will be to ensure that these comps continue to run well and the 7 regions all ensure they deliver the same basic message in promoting the game. It will take another 3 years minimum before a decision on the success "to date' can really be made. At this stage, I believe that if it has worked, the standard of teams will have improved to such a level that some NRL fringe players may be enticed back to NZ.

One of the issues faced by NZRL is a social one. When I first came to New Zealand as a tourist, I asked about League. The person I asked informed me that the League team in his town, Wanganui, had been moved 15 miles away due to a shooting incident. This answer was repeated to me on a number of occassions and after I went to the local library I disovered that a localised fued betwen Black Power and the Mob had ended with the death of a child in a drive by shooting......and because people involved were players on the team, a RL connection had been made....
When I started work here, I asked about Wainuiomata RL and was told not to park my car near the ground as there was "always" trouble after games........the same when I asked if Petone Panthers were a better bet to watch games.

The fact is that 90% of the players in the national and wellington comps (can't comment on other areas) are of pacific or Maori heritage and the culture of "big hits' sometimes enables people to settle scores on the field. I am not sure, but I believe that this "aggression", together with unhelpful journalism such as highlighted above is key in the current situation regarding getting fans to games.

This is one of the key areas that Jim Doyle and his team will be addressing over the next 3 years....the perception that League is a game played by thugs, associated with gangs and settling of scores.

My own experiences of League in the region this year have been nothing other than great. Great people running the game, great people running the clubs and friendly fans.......happy to have a dig about my beloved Quins RL being crap.....

.

I would love to see a franchise in Wellington......but, as I have pointed out in other threads, sports fans in the region are fickle....and Union, soccer, netball, basketball are all suffering from "fanapathy" (copywrite pending

) and I believe that if a Wellington Orcas side were to become an NRL Franchise, then it would have to be with a backer prepared to underwrite the club for 5 or more years..and with an infastructure across all 7 regions that would support it and provide a good breeding ground for the players of the future.

So, that's how the land lies here at the moment. 21,000 went to watch the Kiwis beat England, showing that there are fans in the region, but there are 35,000 fans for the AB's when they play here and only 14,000 for the local premium Union team.....5,000 for the coccer team yet 35,000 for the All Whites.....Wellington Fans need to be courted to folloing league and I believe that 3 Warriors games a year need to played here to really gauge interest........

As I said, I may be wrong, but these are my thoughts on the matter.

or split them into two seperate divisions and introduce promotion an relegation, who knows, we may follow suit........................

Gutterfax is right on the money with much of what he has said.
I have lived in Wellington for most of my 37 years and the comments he has made regarding watching local rugby league and the violent behavior assosiated have been right on the mark in the past.
I live in Upper Hutt, home to the mighty Upper Hutt Tigers. At their home games the Mongrel Mob can be seen perched on the bank on one side of the field in a menacing way which will put off most casual fans from attending. I have worked with quite a few Tiger's players and they have all been great blokes and not gang affiliated but there obviously is another contingent that are. There were always stories in my youth of shootings and brawls involving spectators whenever the supremacy of the Wainui Lions was challenged. I'm not saying it was solely Wainui but being Upper Hutt's main rival for top spot (along with Randwick) in those days they were the stories you heard about.

However, I believe the winds of change are happening.
Rugby League is now in our schools, in my day there was no school rugby league teams, it was rugby or nothing and if you played club league on the weekends your first XV coach would probably drop you. Upper Hutt College just completing a 3rd unbeaten season in the Stephen Kearney cup and the aussie talent scouts are taking notice. The kids know due to Toyota Cup coverage and the many kiwis plying their trade there that there are career opportunities in league that are reachable to them. They also are being taught and see from the TV coverage that they can't do drugs and expect to be picked up by the scouts. This will no doubt flow through to the senior ranks with more dedicated players coming through rather than gang related thugs just trying to show how tough they are. But it will take years.

As for crowds well it's hard to say. Wellington has less than half the population of Auckland and while per capita certainly supports it's sporting teams better there is only so much money people have to spend. Christchurch has the same issue but without the competition of a semi-pro soccer team.

NZ rugby league is moving forward and certainly becoming more main stream, but there is a long way to go. I would love to see a team based in Wellington and think it would be great for the fans and the national side, but I suspect the money side of things would not stack up and at the end of the day it will always come back to that.