I think there may just be more explanation and clarity in [url=http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/bradford-cannot-look-to-rfl-to-bail-them-out-again-after-ground-sale-1-4411686=#800000this[/url piece than we have seen hitherto?

I think, despite the general prejudice against who wrote it, it warrants careful reading? It might just help answer a number of questions, albeit leaving others still to resolve.



Incidentally, there is a hell of a lot in that piece that accords with what I have been given to understand. Maybe, after all, the club HAS used the media to help "get the message out", as Stevo would say?

The part about the role of the RFL etc is especially interesting, I suggest? And how confident are we of retaining a licence in the event of administration?

I must say I have never seen Morrison’s sponsor or even seen their name linked with anything in Yorkshire, maybe it is about time they gave a bit back to the community in the form of a pledge!!
May be I am wrong so don’t shoot me with this comment.

It shouldn't be surprising that there's been limited response from the business community, given the current economic climate. It's also unrealistic to expect businesses, other than those owned by Bulls fans, to respond instantly to an emergency appeal. Their decision making process is likely to be much more considered.

Thinking back to when City went belly up in the 80's, IIRC the initial response to their appeal was fairly disappointing. Eventually they built up some momentum helped by a T&A campaign. The T&A were more than happy to publicise contributions made by businesses. That created a snowball effect, businesses seemed to queuing up to get their donation publicised in the paper. But that's not going to happen during a 2 week appeal.

I guess we won't get the real figure in until Saturday just got to hope and pray.

Interesting that the bank debt is "only" £150k, although it would be surprising if any bank advanced a company as cash strapped as the Bulls much more than that.

I still can't get my head entirely around the RFL deal. If it was an advance against Sky money, presumably some or all of that money will have since become due to the Bulls? So why did we have to pay 60% back? Rather than paying it back wouldnt it just have been offset against the money that became due to us? Or does it represent Sky money that isn't yet due to us? Who was it sang that song "There are more questions than answers"?

I'm not confident that we will retain our license if we go into Administration. But I'm not that confident we'll retain it if we dont.

I cant help but think that more people would be willing to put in the cash if it became clear the board/shareholders were actually putting up some cash themselves.
Its all well and good saying we are actively looking for further investment, but its the fans that are actually having to dig deep. If a statement came from the board with a message of, we have put this amount in or even a short term pledge match offer for example all pledges made wednesday or thursday would be matched by the board, that might tempt the doubters to get involved.
I'm no financial expert but i am sure some dividends would have been paid out during the good times, its only fair they give back now

80% of the shares are held by non-board members.

I suspect we can take it that there is nothing financial expected from the main ones of them. Can you see Caisley chipping in right now?

As I've already said, Hood and Bennett work for free. Directors are already exposed to personal guarantees, and have bought shares off other ex-shareholders (I suspect with little expectation of getting their money back). The only direstors are Hood, Bennett and Duckett. Ryan is a paid employee, notional shareholding only, with hardly a massive salary judging by the accounts, and IMO it would be totally unreasonable to expect him to put his house on the line - would any of you guys do that? Hood and Bennett would likely argue they have already put enough in - in time and money and exposure - and that to expect even more, when they don't even control the club (by a country mile) is unreasonable.

Messrs Caisley, Bates and Agar are the shareholders that between them have around half the shares. Anyone fancy asking them?

Indeed.

I don't normally have a beer at the game, but I might make an exception this week.




Without investment we might scrape the 500k with some creative PR type double counting, especially now as it seems some money from the derby will count when I'm sure we were told previously it would not?

But without outside investment IMO we have zero chance for the next 500k to reach £1m, and then administration will be inevitable and we'll then be waiting for someone (Caisly/Parkin/A.NOther) to pick up the cheap pieces out of admin and we go from there...hopefully.

There are people like my father who have not pledged yet, despite a lifetime of supporting and being a current member they are just so p!ssed off with the club, because ultimately, the bottom line is our club got ourselves into this mess (irrespective of circumstance, change in personal or board, bad luck, outside economic interest, etc etc, the end responsibilty is ours and ours alone - contingencies should have been made when the times were good and bad decisions like Harris should not have been taken) so it feels like throwing good money after bad.

He will pledge, late like many others, I have no doubt, but only out of a blind faith in the history and name and his support over the years rather than any specific belief in the current club.....and if he doesn't I'll probably pledge again on his behalf on Friday.....actually, I think I could do with a drink now.

We're fscked.

You can't blame anybody who doesn't want to throw good money after bad, when there is little to give confidence in the people it is going to be in the hands of.

Rugby League will live on in Bradford as long as there are people who want it to.

Reading the T/A report again sounds like Mr Hood is lieing again about how much money the bulls have rasied in times like ours we need to get the raise amount spot on and dont give fans false hope. Sooner that man gets bought out the better the bulls future will be.

Whilst fully appreciating the economic climate many businesses are struggling to operate in I do ask the business community of Bradford the following: have you ever profited from the Bulls/northern? I am referring particularly to bus and taxi firms, pubs, take-aways, newsagents, sport shops, SUPERMARKETS etc. I also extend this challenge to the RFL and other SL teams who relied on Bull mania to swell the coffers at semi and finals and "away" matches. If there is any spare cash at all in these small, medium and huge businesses I implore you to consider the plight of a business that helped you succeed.

Maybe his beancounter screwed up?

Be careful what you wish for.

I hope you are proved right.
After the game on Friday i was enthused, probably carried away with the atmosphere etc, but now i don't know what to think. I can't believe that whatever the rights and wrongs are of how we got into this situation that anyone who has a remote interest in the Bulls would not consider pledging at least £10/£20?
Every penny counts.

It's all well and good saying i'll put money in but not if this lot stay in charge (initially my own thoughts), but what happens if the club goes down and no one comes forward to reform a Pheonix from the ashes club?

I would be willing to pay up again next month if required, and i would also pay to help form a new club in the Championships if it came down to it.

Not if enough people are convinced we need not be, as the club is seeking.

Or if we have a very quick exit from administration, pre-cleared witrh the RFL, IMO.

Otherwise, yes we very probably are IMO.

Debt free as well. It might be more tempting for any megalomaniacs out there.

Couldn't one of your neighbours in Ilkley sell their dog kennel or something to buy the Bulls?

Of course it will - Dudley Hill, Vic Rangers, Clayton, etc, etc... They will be there after the Bulls have gone. But whether Bradford Bulls will live on in any recognisable form remains to be seen doesn't it?

Surely if it was an advance of the Sky money then there would be no need to pay it back as the club would be entitled to it anyway? That bit doesn't sound right to me? And if it is somehow accurate how did the club expect to pay its dues further down the line without that income to come in? Sounds to me this lots financial strategy is to rob Peter to pay Paul which is always doomed to failure. I would have no confidence at all in anything being different going forward even if the pledge total was reached. And on that note an accurate running total would be be nice as the constant mis-reporting of totals lends creedence to the image of incompetance and adds to the mistrust.

If the 500K deadline is reached what is the deadline for the next batch of 500K?

My Opinion is this.. For the past two seasons i have enjoyed watching the bulls at home and also had the priveledge of watching some outstanding players from other teams for a cost of £60.00 last season which equates to £4.61 a game and £75.00 this season which if we manage to see the season out will be £5.76 a game, I would as a fan been willing to pay the season ticket prices of something like £190.00 per season still a great saving of around £4 to 6 per game against paying on the gate every week. therefore i have no problem in pledging my share. The issue i believe with the club is that the season ticket pledge was just too cheap., ok we may have only got around 6 or 7 thousand holders but at even £160.00 a pop would have been £1.2million as opposed to the £800 k or so we got for 10800+ Members. maybe it all seems black and white from my eyes but isnt that as a sports fan how you want it to be... Please for the sake of our club PLEDGE NOW..

I see that "Into the Abyss" will be showing at Pictureville on Friday night. I have a fear that I'll be watching something very similar at Odsal.

Thing being up a well known creek without a paddle is very apt now

Nah, have faith. Its not an abyss, its a wormhole. That we will use to transit across the delta quadrant, evade HMRC, the bank, the RFL, the Borg, the Romulans and other nasties, and emerge pristine at the other side cleansed of everything that is a threat to us.

That Einstein guy, he knew nowt.

In fact, if we can apply quantum theory and all that to money, and make it be in two places at once: job sorted.

The management of this club has gone out of its way to feed us with either lies or the results of its incompetence, and that article is just the latest in a long line of examples. It might have been intended as a desperate plea but I suspect a great many of those who were undecided about whether to pledge or not have just been turned away by it.

Utter idiocy from Hood.