John Bateman will not be going anywhere, unless it is to save the club.

Income from gate receipts? When most people who attend have already paid, i cant see the away support generating enough to cover our wage roll

It would seem that Bulls are currently worth roughly minus £1m and would be worth roughly minus £500k post pledge. I didnt think Caisley actually owned shares, just controlled Jack Bates' shares, but even if he did the £125k improvement would be from minus £250k to minus £125k!

Live on West Yorkshire Sport daily from 6pm tonight Bradford Bulls RL chairman Peter Hood. Listen in on BBC Leeds 92.4FM.

Could anyone clarify what the position of the RFL would be if we end up in Administration?

How much, roughly, would they be owed as a creditor?

And, to what extent could they use their position to maximise their negotiating position? For example, could they insist that any successor company would not be admitted into any RFL competitions without re-paying any debts owing to the RFL by the existing company?

We have been given to understand the advance from last year has been repaid.

No idea if they owe us or if we owe them at this point in the year.

Rent is usually paid in advance, but who knows.

Our entitlement to Sky monies and other central funding would doubtless be voided in the event of insolvency.

There may well be a reversionary clause in the lease, same was as there was in the lease with the council - if not tenant paying rent for minimum of x years, repay £x amount on sliding scale - sort of thing.

The lease will doubtless be voidable in the event of insolvency, anf the RFL could enter into a new lease with the phoenix company on whatever terms they agreed.

The RFL could insist on any terms it chose, regarding a phoenix company repaying monies owed by the failed copmpany. Whether it could persuade the phoenix to pay up would be a matter between the parties, and would reflect their respective bargaining positions.

My suspicion is that a phoenix company would be in a strong initial position, since the RFL and Sky would be very very keen to have Phoenix stand seamlessly in place of Failed, with the mimimum disruption. But only if we had a prepack, and Phoenix was all set up waiting in the wings and ready to rock. The longer the intrerregnum went on, the more the club's pklayers and other assets would be likley to dissipate IMO, and the less likelihood IMO of Phoenix taking to the air.

Peter Hood has just said on Radio Leeds that the immediate creditors are the bank and HRMC, no mention of the RFL.

Doesnt sound like there's any immediate prospect of a white knight.

It still seems very vague as to what makes up the difference between the £500k and the £1m. Not clear whether its ongoing losses or whether there are other specific big bills in the pipeline.

It still doesnt give me any confidence that, if the pledge raises the £500k, we will not be in the same situation in 6 months, and all of that money raised by the fans will be wasted.

Still mulling over my pledge/not pledge decision.

If you have a new board or person taking over from admin they will have to pass a fit and proper business test. When glover did this the RFL took a Some time over this and this is when the cultures came in.

If you have a new board or person taking over from admin they will have to pass a fit and proper business test. When glover did this the RFL took a Some time over this and this is when the cultures came in.

Sorry vultures I hate iPhone text

Supercat...exactly!!!!!

That is why I keep saying that unless there is a prepack in place already (and that would presumably mean the RFL had already issued the necessary confidential assurances), the longer the interregnum the greater the damage - and the greater the mountain for the phoenix to climb.

RFL already repaid, AFAIK. Hence the crisis now the bank pulled the facility. Club is currently paying down the overdraft (enforced - bank reducing teh facility £ for £ on monies banked, I believe). I have posted previously about the tax, and that in particular the club does not have big, old arrears. Most of the liability only falls due in April, I believe.

[listDate Of Accounts 31/12/2010
Turnover £3,956,715
Cost of Sales £3,127,144
Gross Profit £829,571
Wages & Salaries £2,447,753
Directors Emoluments £16,978
Operating Profit -£373,530
Depreciation £101,518
Audit Fees £12,500
Interest Payments £3,267
Pre Tax Profit -£311,403
Taxation -
Profit After Tax -£311,403
Dividends Payable -
Retained Profit -£311,403

[/list:u

The last accounts filed show £300K loss

I would like to see where in the pecking order of super league clubs have the Bull finished with their near £4.000.000 turnover

Sorry to ask a naive question but if you are not making a profit, how can you owe tax? Surely only profit is taxable - not a deficit?

VAT
PAYE
NIC
Retrospective PAYE on image rights etc

Aye. They were filed end Sept and discussed on here at the time.

The cash numbers are if anything rather more important, as is the wording of several key notes.

Can anyone (Adey

) explain how the club have ended up with a big HRMC bill THAT THEY DID NOT KNOW ABOUT? My understanding (from reading about it on here some time ago) was that the image rights thing had been sorted or at the very least had been allowed for.

No scrub that, I am being dim aren't I? They did know about it, but just can't pay it due to the bank closing the overdraft down? Is that correct?

That and having to pay off the RFL earlier than expected, seemingly.

You being dim? [iYou[/i might suppose that; I could not possibly comment...

Today's T&A suggests the pledge may have 'hit the wall' www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... usinesses/ In summary * less than £250K pledged * only 1600 members have pledged * virtually no response from businesses / sponsors * no takeover or major investment on the cards

Today's T&A suggests the pledge may have 'hit the wall' www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... usinesses/ In summary * less than £250K pledged * only 1600 members have pledged * virtually no response from businesses / sponsors * no takeover or major investment on the cards

And in the next instalment of today's PR masterclass...



I suppose we have been asking to be told more of the facts. Not sure it was these sort of facts that folk had in mind though.

There are any number of people wanting more explanation or clarification regarding aspects of how we ended up in this situation. And perhaps, more to the point, why - post a successful pledge campaign - we won't ever end up in a similar one again. I've implored the club to do so. Its not too late for that to happen, but time is fast running out.

Quote ="paulwalker71"Today's T&A suggests the pledge may have 'hit the wall' www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... usinesses/ In summary * less than £250K pledged * only 1600 members have pledged * virtually no response from businesses / sponsors * no takeover or major investment on the cards '" Only 1,600 ST holders have pledged! What is wrong with the people Bradford? Wake up and do something for once rather than just sit moaning. YOU ARE ABOUT TO LOSE YOUR RUGBY LEAGUE CLUB! Your season tickets cost nothing. If you lose the Bulls you might has well hang the closed sign up at the end of the M606.

Quote ="paulwalker71"Today's T&A suggests the pledge may have 'hit the wall' www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... usinesses/ In summary * less than £250K pledged * only 1600 members have pledged * virtually no response from businesses / sponsors * no takeover or major investment on the cards '" Only 1,600 ST holders have pledged! What is wrong with the people Bradford? Wake up and do something for once rather than just sit moaning. YOU ARE ABOUT TO LOSE YOUR RUGBY LEAGUE CLUB! Your season tickets cost nothing. If you lose the Bulls you might has well hang the closed sign up at the end of the M606.

Quote ="paulwalker71"Today's T&A suggests the pledge may have 'hit the wall' www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... usinesses/ In summary * less than £250K pledged * only 1600 members have pledged * virtually no response from businesses / sponsors * no takeover or major investment on the cards '" The number of pledges is fairly meaningless. Families will make one pledge for whatever they can afford. For example my sister pledged £200 to cover her and her partner, rather than each pledging £100. They were never likely to receive more than 3,000 individual pledges.

Quote ="paulwalker71"Today's T&A suggests the pledge may have 'hit the wall' www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... usinesses/ In summary * less than £250K pledged * only 1600 members have pledged * virtually no response from businesses / sponsors * no takeover or major investment on the cards '" The number of pledges is fairly meaningless. Families will make one pledge for whatever they can afford. For example my sister pledged £200 to cover her and her partner, rather than each pledging £100. They were never likely to receive more than 3,000 individual pledges.

This is grim news. Friday is going to be emotional.