Valley Parade will be the death of the club.

TBH I don't think the chances of the OSV are any worse (or better) than they have ever been, I don't think the "cuts" affect it a great deal. The big question is and always has been whether there is a real desire on the part of the local authority to push it through, that is what has been sorely lacking in Bradford for many decades and if the current or recent councils had really wanted things to happen then they could have made them happen much quicker. It was and remains at least "possible" as opposed to all the previous "pie in the sky" schemes but was and remains unlikely to progress for the foreseeable. By which I mean REAL progress towards picks and shovels, not six-monthly talking shops.

I remember clearly reading that the big issue with a cantilever on the popular terrace is that Odsal is built on a tip and this would make constructing anything modern ruinously expensive, which is why the cheaper option, apparently, was to fill in the bowl and build on top. One of the biggest shames of the plan was that we would forever lose that magnificent and awe-inspiring Odsal bowl, but as the bean-counters of the OSV plans have decreed that - even if we had the money in place to build it tomorrow - we can't afford to build around the edges, but must fill it in for cost reasons, then there's your answer, the cost of supporting a cantilever stand over the terrace makes it not feasible. Not impossible, if you have enough money you can build anything anywhere - just financially not feasible.

Building a shed roof with supports, a la Coral stand, would just be embarrassing. Thank god there's zero chance of it happening.

It may end up our only option. Odsal in it's present state isn't fit for purpose, that's what the chairman says and he's right.

The club will find it increasingly difficult if it stays in an undeveloped Odsal. It's massive financial millstone as it is and will only cost more and more eventually dragging it under.

As has been said above the Council have never had the will to do anything with it and that means it'll never get re-developed.

I predict we'll be at VP within 5 years.

One of the things I don't understand is the need to fill in the bowl. You have got to have terracing. If the bowl is filled you then need to build new concrete terraces. Unless I am missing something.

The whole site is apparently highly unstable because it is an old tip. Hence (as FA too recalls) why it is apparently not financially practicable to anchor a decent cantilever structure. You need a solid hardcore base, which the filled-in bowl (as PH explained at the last FF) would then provide.

Then of course you would not need to build anything like such high terraces, because your new stadium would have a lower capacity BUT would have terracing (whether covered in seast or not) on all sides. And of course you can put all sorts of useful things under or abutting the concrete trerracing for only modest extra cost, like food outlets, bars, bogs, offices, corporate facilities changing rooms, massage parlours (for Tigertot), baby changing facilities (for Angela powers), creche (for Gledhill)...all of which you would otherwise have to build separately or use what is there now like the far-from-ideal Coral Stand.

I just think that the same could happen with us moving to Valley Parade as the crowds will drop off significantly (history repeating itself again).

Just make sure I have a good view of the pitch.

I still find it difficult to understand why it isn't cheaper to build a simple cantilever over what is there already. Sinking piles 50m into the ground is not unusual. IIRC Trafford Centre is built off landfill. The vital corporate facilities are usually at the back of the stand to give clear views of the pitch, these could be formed at the back of the stand/concourse level. I am so intrigued I will discuss the options with our structural engineering consultants.

Dont worry everyone, in 3 years when i come to power ill build us a nice 50k stadium, ill also say odsal is a home so ill claim expences on it, i will also buy the club and give all my fellow Bradfordians free season tickets, just you wait.

If you run for PM, you have my vote mate

Hood's always said Plans B, C and D are in place...

What was your Crowds like when you went down to VP mate?
If I remember rightly, it wasn't as bad as people made out?

It's a real shame that it sounds like the OSV isn't going to happen but if people are honest with themselves it's been a long long way off for years!
My Granddad sadly passed away 11 years ago, Bradford Northern was his team and he loved the walk from Clayton up to Odsal, even in those years there was talks about the OSV being made a reality.

VP is a nice Ground, it's just a shame about the area. If only you could pick the Ground up and plonk it somewhere else in Bradford!

Crowds by historic standards plummeted towards the end at VP. Was not helped by what became a mass boycott by many away fans, not least from Leeds.

Why was that mate, don't remember this?

Went to the Games at VP quite enjoyed it actually

Various reasons/theories were advanced. In fact, the OVERALL stats

1996 10,346
1997 15,159
1998 13,022
1999 13,212
2000 14,520
2001 13,000
2002 13,912
2003 14,939
2004 13,495
2005 12,786
2006 14,406
2007 12,083

don't really bear this out, strangely enough. I think it was more the trend towards the end of the 2002 that became increasingly apparent.

the season that did the real damage was 2004 though. The club won everything going in 2003, and they budgetted on increased crowds as a result for 2004. in fact crowds fell sharply, something that caused the previous chairman to have a real nasty go at the fans about in his annual report. he had a very good point, although he also maybe failed to appreciate some of the reasons why the crowd levels were not maintained - for some of which he should have looked close to home.

The boycotts were to do with the stewarding at VP. I remember more boycotts by Saints fans than Leeds though. Promises of at least, if not actual boycotts.

A permanent move would be very different though, wouldn't it?

I'd like to think it would be home to the bulls and city, not just the bulls playing in city's stadium.

Personally, I marginally favor a move there, it's not as made as some make out IMO.

Dual branding and pitch lengthening would be my only 2 changes

Pitch lengthening would be a big job and I suspect very expensive to be honest. It's hard to see what could be done with the kop, other than removing several seats at the front, whilst the Bradford end is too small to take anything away but is tight for room behind the stand, so is impossible to move back. If a permanent move were to be made though, it would be essential as VP, with its solid walls, literally inches from the dead ball lines, is a serious spinal or head injury waiting to happen, in its current state.

It's hard to get away from the decline in attendances when we were there before though. We need to hope it doesn't come to that.

I seriously hope it doesn't come to VP. One thing I love about Odsal is being able to stand whilst watching my Rugby. Plus I still have memories of the season ticket holders in front of me who brought an inflatable purple alien to every home match and waved it in front of my view each home game.

I can see you are still a little traumatised by this experience!!!

Gledhill was much younger then though.

Not Gledhill this time, well unless he use to be a young girl? Which seems unlikely? Maybe I'd be less of a grumpty git 2nd time around.. but that's possibly even more unlikely!

IRRC Mark Lawn suggested that the council buy Valley Parade and make the necessary modifications to the pitch/stadium. I guess one option could be to remove rows from the front of the Kop, or even demolish the Bradford End.

I have a couple of thoughts on this.

First of all what is 'fit for purpose'? Can you or can you not watch a Rugby League game at Odsal in it's present format? Yes, you can... so despite the fact that could do with some work to make it more comfortable for fans on a wet day I don't see any reason for a stupidly expensive development just so we can compete with other clubs in saying that our stadium is shinier that yours. Stadiums and the new Pianist extentions.

What is a concern is that at the fans forum IIRC Peter Hood hinted that whilst the ground looked good (and there isn't a stadium I'd rather be at on a sunny sunday afternoon) there were problems developing behind the scenes that needed to be rectified sooner rather than later and that fixing those issues would be expensive.

Personally I would hate to go to Valley Parade unless it really was a case of that or nothing.

With regards to simply putting a roof on the popular side... I can't believe that in this day and age and with some of the stadiums that are being developed and built around the world that we're limited to having to use poles! If it's going to be developed it needs to be done right rather than just done cheap (like the adage says: buy once, buy twice) In a perfect world that would include decent corporate facilities to bring in income and a couple of bars for me! Maybe build back onto the lower level path that runs behind the current stand and develop the grass banking to allow access to the terraces all along that side on the ground. If there is one thing that Odsal has in abundance it's space... it's just a case of having the money, technology and imagination to use it!

You want to see it now...It's worse!!