bit hard to tap up a player who has just had his contract anulled by his previous employer by them ceasing to exist and before he has actually agreed to be tupe'd over to the newco.......he is a free agent in the time space between, also he has a limted amount of time after a tupe'd situation if he was not consulted/kept aware of the ongoing situation.

Will you also be expecting them to come down hard on those who go into administration again?

Read the T&A today, gives a very good explanation from a sports lawyer how it works

Erm directly from Hull? Radford and vaikona were not straight forward deals were they?

Solomona? the whole we will get him for free because they are relegated never happened did it?

Iestyn? some might say that was a form of tapping up ?

These are just a couple of examples off top of my head, we are by far not innocent of all this, we are just upset because we are very vulnerable to it at moment. what goes around comes around.
As for Tupe - like has been said he can cancel contract but as proven previously, we will be backed up when attempts to transfer his registration are made. You will get him but it wont be for nothing.

Whatever Mcdonnell has been paid off will still count against cap, I dont believe Half of mcdonnells wage and pitts would cover losing a decent two year deal for a year?

might kill any potential for a coaching career simply by his indecisiveness. Situation on leaving hull, situation now when he is coaching under 19's - may help himself short term but this could bite him. Interviewer would you describe yourself as loyal? (google says different)

I would have thought recent events would have shown that whatever he intended many of OK's statements were not correct. I suspect that was due to niaivity rather than deceit but there you go.

When a club is in Administration and a Player's Agent approaches the Administrator for consent to speak to other clubs to protect his Client's interests the Administrator is obliged to give that consent. That happened for far more players than Craig Kopczak, many Bradford players quite legitimately had potential deals lined up. There were no illegal approaches. When the previous Bradford incarnation tried to Tupe players across to OK Bulls Craig Kopczak declined. You may not like that, but that is what happened.

Ok reported Giants to RFL who were obliged to investigate, in doing so Huddersfield Giants produced a copy of written consent to speak to Craig Kopczak. The RFL could not find anything other than they were entitled to sign the player but that Bradford were entitled to compensation to transfer the registration.

Ok no doubt looked a bit silly in RFL eyes but I suspect he was not very well advised. Ok later resurrected his claims after the Mason affair, that seems more to do with saying the right thing to the Bulls fanbase.

The Giants royally shafted Keith Mason and were rightly made to compensate him properly, that was shameful but did not in any way make discussing a future contract with Craig Kopczak an illegal approach.

Gareth Carvell is also entitled to decline TUPE transfer, CK has given a precedent, if GC wants to leave he can, do Bulls 2014 even have a SL licence? i am sure they will have the transfer endorsed, but that hasn't happened yet.

I do have sympathy with the supporters of Bradford Bulls, but you have to understand the bad guys are not Huddersfield Giants, Hull FC or Wakefield Trinity Wildcats. Those responsible for the angst you are being put through are the previous custodians of your club: Caisley, Hood, Whitcutt & OK amongst them, many astonishing levels of incompetance have been shown.

I hope for your sake the new lot are better.

Indeed. They could hardly be much worse...?

Excellent post, GD.

Although the usual suspects on the Wakey forum are stupidly doing their level best to give people every reason to view them as bad guys too.

Quote ="domthebull" Whatever Mcdonnell has been paid off will still count against cap, I dont believe Half of mcdonnells wage and pitts would cover losing a decent two year deal for a year? '" I was under the assumption that if they never played they would be exempt from the cap..... however having read your point and nipping to check the rules and prove you woefully wrong, i hit a snag. www.therfl.co.uk/the-rfl/rules/i ... section=E1 E1:3:1 Quote A Club’s “Players” are the 25 Players registered with the Club and eligible to play in the Super League who have the highest Salary Cap Values at the time in question, whether or not they have played for the Club in a Salary Cap Relevant Match in the Salary Cap Year to that date, in addition to all other players at the club who will or do play in a Salary Cap Relevant Match. '" Also if this was allowed, it could/would mean a very simple way to work around the cap.

Quote ="domthebull" Whatever Mcdonnell has been paid off will still count against cap, I dont believe Half of mcdonnells wage and pitts would cover losing a decent two year deal for a year? '" I was under the assumption that if they never played they would be exempt from the cap..... however having read your point and nipping to check the rules and prove you woefully wrong, i hit a snag. www.therfl.co.uk/the-rfl/rules/i ... section=E1 E1:3:1 Quote A Club’s “Players” are the 25 Players registered with the Club and eligible to play in the Super League who have the highest Salary Cap Values at the time in question, whether or not they have played for the Club in a Salary Cap Relevant Match in the Salary Cap Year to that date, in addition to all other players at the club who will or do play in a Salary Cap Relevant Match. '" Also if this was allowed, it could/would mean a very simple way to work around the cap.

I also agree with GD

The RFL are nothing if not inconsistent. You might be surprised by what they might and might not 'back up' - as we've found to our cost before. And in any case, paying a fee for Carvell wouldn't be an issue.


Not necessarily. Have a read of the cap rules - there are plenty of ways to get around this.

Quote ="hullbg"I was under the assumption that if they never played they would be exempt from the cap..... however having read your point and nipping to check the rules and prove you woefully wrong, i hit a snag. www.therfl.co.uk/the-rfl/rules/i ... section=E1 E1:3:1 Also if this was allowed, it could/would mean a very simple way to work around the cap.'" That just defines 'players'. You need to look at the parts which calculate cap value, and the parts dealing with player contracts. There are ways and means to offset part or all of the cap value when a player leaves, depending on when, why, and how it happens. In fact there are now so many clauses and exemptions to the cap it basically boils down to whatever you can convince the cap panel to allow.

Quote ="hullbg"I was under the assumption that if they never played they would be exempt from the cap..... however having read your point and nipping to check the rules and prove you woefully wrong, i hit a snag. www.therfl.co.uk/the-rfl/rules/i ... section=E1 E1:3:1 Also if this was allowed, it could/would mean a very simple way to work around the cap.'" That just defines 'players'. You need to look at the parts which calculate cap value, and the parts dealing with player contracts. There are ways and means to offset part or all of the cap value when a player leaves, depending on when, why, and how it happens. In fact there are now so many clauses and exemptions to the cap it basically boils down to whatever you can convince the cap panel to allow.

Just let him go.

Shown no respect to the club, the fans and most of all his colleagues and fellow proffesionals. www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... long_game/

Shown no respect to the club, the fans and most of all his colleagues and fellow proffesionals. www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... long_game/

Folk do what they want. Let him go and get on with the job.

If you think that Bradford have never tapped up a player you are deluded, all clubs do it.

Your lot have vultured around clubs over the years...you took radders & vaikona off us many moons ago.

Think this dispute will only end one way and its going to be a particularly nasty one I'd guess at the moment.

The TUPE laws might cover the contractual side, but as Garreth knows full well from his previous time at Hull FC, its the registration document with the RFL that is important...

I wonder if he fully remembers signing the last contract with Hull FC under duress before his agent told him to withdraw it, only to discover he couldn't due to it being registered at Red Hall? Amazing how that has not been mentioned in any of the posts I've read.

I also wonder if he'll remember being told that he'd end up rotting in the reserves until nobody had room in the cap unless someone forked out a transfer fee? Again something that has conveniently been missed off.

Finally, I wonder if Garreth will remember turning up to the recent fans photoshoot at Odsal 2days after the transfer of club assets to the newco? He certainly seemed quite happy then wearing all his Bulls kit proudly

I would have surely thought that someone unhappy in their employment and potentially in dispute would have given that kind of thing a miss???

Or perhaps its just the fact that Andy Clarke fancied another payday like he did with various other players???

Either way, I hope for the sake of both clubs this is resolved quickly so that we can all move on to more important business.

Roll on next week

We have lost most of our young talent? I wouldn't call Bateman, Whitehead and Naughton MOST of our young talent... what about Addy, Olbison, Donaldson, O Brian, Roberts, Wood and Mellor???

Lost half our sky money... yep but nothing this lot can do about that.

Can't sell enough season tickets... can you actually remember the average crowds at Odsal in the 80's and early 90's??? I can and some weren't even half of what we get now!!! Check here... [urlhttp://www.rugbyleagueproject.org/matches/Custom/MzMtLS0tLTU3LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t[/url it might remind you.

In administration for fun??? So that's twice then... i'll remind the wife that "fun" now equates to just two occasions



we have a loan shark's axe hanging over our heads??? Really??? Do we??? I thought loan sharks were highly illegal and would come round and break your legs for not paying up??? Oh, you mean reputable and licenced loan companies then, eh???

Our new signing wants away before he's made a tackle? He deserves to be sacked if he failed to make a tackle on his debut again Hull FC three weeks ago... surprised they even want him if that was the case



We have just been slaughtered in two pre season games killing stone dead any optimism. If you expected us to beat Rams with the squad we had on the day then so be it... Cas I can't complain with you there.

We have the most uninspiring squad of players that I can ever remember??? Where have you been since 2006???

Just slightly OT a little but I noticed today that the Bulls are actually employing someone on their coaching staff who is also a player agent, possibly with the same company as the said agent in this saga???

Could be something or nothing but it stinks that potentially more players and coaches are involved in this stirring than first meets the eye!!!

How has he "messed you about"?

Are you thick or something?



Now, the Bulls (as is crystal from their own statement) did not "make Hull aware of Carvell's availability" so wo do you think it might have been? Some possibilities:
(a) Carvell's agent
(b) Archbishop Desmond Tutu
(c) Popeye



The bulls have seemingly not heard a peep though, not from Carvell, not from his agent. The T & A tried to speak to them, but neither Carvell nor his agent were available for comment.



Carvell has not come out to say anything in public about his attitude to his 2 year contract. He could have done. Yet the club is as much in the dark as everyone, with the apparent exception of Hull FC. So, is he messing us about, or not, flower?

Touched a nerve.

$$At least we had some half decent youngsters to stir the enthusiasm.I have never felt so despondent at the start of a season.

No he answered your frankly BIZARRE question. Your response to THAT makes you look suprisingly like a troll considering your huge post count.

Think you misinterpret his response.

Standard operating procedure for so many on thse forums, when they come out with a oh-so-clever statement, and someone has the temerity to rebut them with facts. Ignore the rebuttal - since they have no answer - and instead go [iad hominem[/i and seek to divert the argument down a different direction. As this guy has. The automatic response to what he said is to reject or deny it. But by doing so, you have allowed him to move the argument to one of HIS choosing. They frequently put up a straw man or three too.

I think they go to the Wakefield forum for their training.

FWIW, I hold the Hull FC fans blameless in this (of course), and I suspect Hull FC will have no case to answer but maybe a modest fee to pay. The agent, of course, this vermin one again, will be the real villain of the piece and should be deprived of his gonads and then defenestrated.

Is that a serious question?
Bizarre.