The difference is that while fans have a whinge about it happily, it is unusual to see a senior official from a club criticise the dealings of other clubs which do not directly affect his club. It's also pretty off-message from the previous RFL/SL line.

Well considering we would assume Saints arent chasing Bulls fans and sponsors, then other clubs gaining from a possible Bulls demise would adversly affect Saints

Might as well have put 'because Saints always beat Bulls in cup finals'...

I'm a Saints Fan and I've got to say that I hope you lot come through this in one piece. Me and my family enjoy our away trips to odsal. Its a great atmosphere at your ground and the fans are friendly. It would be a tradgedy if you go out of the competition when we have the likes of London/ Catalans and their 3 away fans who do nothing for the atmosphere. At least you bring some away support. And your not a bunch of animals like Hull/Hull KR. Who should be ushered into cages when they arrive just to be on the safe side. LOL

I have always rated McManus, big time. He is a shrewd operator, and he saved Saints and turned the club around, not least (as far as I can see) by bringing in capable people.

I was quite upset when I got the impression he was angling after our downfall. It seemed out of character.

Having read his wonderful, and so very powerful piece today, I don't know why I was worrying. The man is a hero. He deserves the freedom of the City.

Great piece from League Express and McManus and I wholeheartedly agree with him.

The only bit that lets the article down is his insistance of reducing SL to "less than 14 clubs". Bulls would have a lot more support to stay in SL from clubs like mine (Cas Tigers) , clubs that are at risk of getting the chop if this was cleared up.

Shock horror - some SL chairman want to see Bradford stay in SL!!!







ATEOTD it doesn't really matter what the opinions of the chairmen are - it's all going to come down to the viability of the business plans of the bidders being considered by the RFL. If there's a sustainable plan involving a reasonable CVA and without "silly" season ticket pricing then IMHO the Bulls will retain their licence.

On the other hand, if the "best" business plan involves liquidation of the current company and no tangible payments towards the creditors, then I wouldn't be surprised if the Bulls don't have a SL licence in 2013 & 2014.

The most important thing that needs to come out of this whole process is for Bradford's professional rugby league club to simply have a future, rather than a future that MUST be in SL. If the powers that be decide that the SL licence will be forfeited, there will still be the ability for the club to regain it at a future date. Surely this is far better than a "Super League or bust" mentality!

If Bulls lose the SL Licence, it's no way back and likely oblivion in my view. Always has been.

The only way back would be with an owner with some real Brass. But such a bidder will not want to see the club relegated in the first place. So it seems to me we will either keep the Licence or disappear.

The Hull KR chairman was on radio humberside this morning (about 7.30) and was talking about us at the end of his piece about KR, saying he "felt a change in the mood within SL clubs and chairmen towards Bradford being in SL for 2013" or words to that effect, I can't remember the exact phrase.

He said he expected us to be in SL in 2013, but that was just his feeling, he hadn't been told anything or spoken to anyone. Definetly seems to be a change in the wind.

that doesn't say a lot about the 10,000+ fans, if we can't play with the big boys then we wont support the club in a lower league and fight to get back in the big time. It all depends on whether Bradford get a serious backer who want's to put money into the club for the love of the game as RL certainly isn't a cash cow generating massive profits. A credible offer that sees the creditors get a reasonable return and the RFL will most likely keep the status quo the Bulls in super league.......

I agree that whoever ends up with the Bulls (or any other RL club for that matter) needs deep pockets, but there isn't a great prospect of any financial return for them in the long term. If the buyer has got the business acumen to have earned themselves sufficient wealth to fund the Bulls in the longer term, why would they "only" consider acquiring the Bulls on the basis that they are forking out up to £1.5m to deal with a mess that wasn't of their making and then have to immediately invest further to assemble a competitive squad for next year?

I'm not suggesting that none of the potential purchasers won't consider dealing with the "old" debts as part of their business plan, just that it isn't a foregone conclusion.

You surely can't be saying that you won't continue to support the Bulls if the new owners business plan doesn't include retaining the SL licence?

Who said that?


Really? Because, you reckon that such a person does exist, but has forgotten to step up? Do you know his name? Mr. Yeti, perhaps?

If by "dealing with" you mean "paying", that is dead right. Any offers will be exactly that, pence in the £ offers so far as creditors are concerned. Anyone who really believes that there is someone out there who will start by repaying the failed company's historic debt in full needs to stay off the sauce for a while.

Then the Championships it is

I'd suggest that is the only business plan that will keep your licence , it would seem that is not currently on the table

I hope you're wrong but it doesn't look good to me.

If that's the case then to run a championship club we'd still need a backer. Might be a big ask. Would need some sort of deal to play at Odsal for nowt or next to nowt. As a SL club we couldn't afford the upkeep, we've even less chance in the championship.

I can see it being SL or bust.

You will if owned by SLE , that is/was the whole point of the RFL/SLE offer

It was to guarantee this seasons ' integrity ' , Guarantee a club playing at Odsal , and guarantee a Bradford RL club

It is SL that has busted you , essemtially without a sugar daddy , you will not/never be a SL club again , it really is that simple

I know. Trouble is that I can see us not being a club at all.

A sugar daddy is going to be harder to find for a championship club.

that's a bit of a profound statement....... maybe not a top 4 club without some form of outside investment but with 10,000+ fans super league is certainly attainable

I do not agree that if we don't keep the license for SL the club will disappear into the ether. I am confident there will be professional Rugby league in Bradford whatever happens. It might need a complete rebuilding from a lower division but I just cannot see all our fans being prepared to give up.
But at the same time the chances of retaining the license seem to have improved markedly.
The comments from the Hull KR owner suggest to me that some clubs have come round to a view that SL is a "lesser entity without them" (exact quote from St Eamonn) and that must be a positive development .
So let's continue to hope and let's stop assuming that some clubs are hell bent on kicking us out. All the speculation about particular clubs and owners gets us nowhere and might even antagonise . For example all the nonsense about Huddersfield refusing to sell us tickets turned out to be just that-- nonsense. All it did was provoke some Giants fans who love their club as much as we love ours to join in an unhealthy debate. Many had assumed that Saints either didn't care or might be wanting us out to reduce the size of the league-- then Mr McManus releases the most positive statement we could hope for.
I will wait until an owner or a club makes their attitude clear by a statement or by an action before I comment or rush to judgement.

The crucial issue is whether it is a newco. A oldco Bradford should definately retain their SL place. A newco has to be judged on its merits - if it is given a place based solely or primarily on the arguments outlined by EM, then we have to drop licensing. Either bring back P&R in some form or just bite the bullet and give out proper franchises. We really couldn't pretend any more. Aside from anything else it distracts from what goes on, on the pitch.

Oldco - fine and we can carry on.
Newco allowed to apply alongside others - also fine, though time would be short.
Newco, waved through - fine too, but licensing has to die. No great loss with hindsight.

The problem is , it would appear the Bulls fans will not turn up in those numbers unless they ARE top 4 , or they ARE paying peanuts for tickets

Add to that a ' market value ' rental for Odsal and the business plan for SL starts to fall down , I'd suggest that is how the RFL see it

I have looked back at the marketing bumf I got for last year. I paid well over £200 for my season ticket. I have checked the list and do not see that any season ticket was available for peanuts, or indeed any type of indehiscent fruit. Money seemed to be the only advertised option.

So the situation is even worse than we thought , if you have 10,000 fans paying full wack and 1,2 million from SKY , and you are still losing hundreds of thousands a year , you really are foooked

Guess that's one Chairman on your side , .. Is he thinking of Rugby league / bradford bulls

, OR has he just got "£" signs in his eyes., (sweaty £20 notes in bradford pockets)

May be other Chairman may see things from a different point of view come end of the season ?

Whatever happens wont be right or fair for a lot of people in RL.watching on !......Wot a mess !



Leicence system not worked.