Maybe he's actually one of the best young coaches in the country, thus the high praise from players and coaches he works with, but the head coaches job is taking him away from what he does well. I think we can say he's not shown great tactical awareness (2 weak defenders down the same side, substitutions that don't change games positively) and, given the apparent poor motivation in difficult situations displayed by the players, isn't a great motivator.
Tactics and motivation are often a side effect of experience, and I'd hold up someone like John Kear as an example of this, and MacNamara doesn't have that.

I'm a massive John Kear fan, but he hasn't always been successful. He certainly seems to be improving with age. Perhaps Mac is still too naiive, he may well make it one day. I'm sure Brad Fittler was the best young coach in Aus not too long ago.

That's the thing, the Kear of now appears to get the sum to be more than the parts and i think a significant component of that is tactics and motivation.
Can we wait until Mac develops this side of his coaching, if he ever does?

why don't you ask Jimmy Lowes to come back, don't think i would stand in his way

Whereas Mac seems to get a fraction of the component parts.

As a head coach his Warrington team showed many of the same deficiencies we currently have and his experience as head coach is more limited. So unless he wasn't trying previously he's still the unfinished article as a head coach.

As a moral boost to the fans he'd take some of the pressure off the club and if he could impart some of the cunning and desire to win he showed as a player he'd be welcome by me.

Increasingly agreed.

The long term plan is the long term plan for the club, not a particular coach.

Yes McNamara has obviously played a role in it, now that the people who run the club have realised the importance of having a good youth development structure and setup, but it is something that has to be in place irrespective of who the current first team coach is. We can't just stick with someone who isn't doing a very good job of coaching the first team because he happened to be in the post when we started working towards getting the structures back in place.

Leeds and Saints have both had numerous coaching changes in the last few years, but their kids keep coming through, it isn't linked and the idea of it all falling down because the first team coach doesn't make any sense unless, as I suggested a few weeks ago, he is funding it all himself!

We have appointed a number of youth scouts and coaches over the last couple of years who are there to look after this, let them got on with it and hopefully the first team and the club will reap the rewards, not a specific employee.

Still beating the same drum?

At first I considered this to be a curious argument, now I find it downright bemusing. The club is going backwards under McNamara and even if these future stars make it as top RL players then they will no doubt want to leave us to play at a higher level.

Anyway, given McNamara's record with established players, what on earth is there to suggest that he can make stars out of young kids?

OK, as requested, to clarify:

Based on what we know (as opposed to what people guess or assume or want to believe) I defo do not want the club to lose Macca. I believe what he has done and been doing on the youth and academy development, and trying to build a production line for the future pretty well from scratch (after the near fatal situation the current regime inherited) is vital - the history books will record that fact. I'm sure that particular role must be ongoing, regardless of whatever else happens.

But, there is clearly something very very wrong with this team. I don't think a single poster on here could deny that (even Tiger Beer

) Whether its trouble in t'camp a la early 2005 or 1998, or lack of commitment, or lack of discipline, or poor coaching, or what - maybe some combination - is unclear. But something is very very badly wrong, and it has GOT to be sorted. I am sure we don't need to tell you that, Mr Hood? This season is surely gone, barring a miracle of biblical proportions - and the implications of that financially and otherwise will no doubt haunt us now for some time. So we MUST get this sorted for next season. The apparent loss of form of and rumours about players like Burgess don't just happen for nothing, surely?

I do not for one minute think you can blame the coaching staff for everything - that's the usual easy option for fans of any club anywhere. Its the players screw up on the park or don't look like they are at the races, after all. But equally, they must be far from blameless - no such thing as bad soldiers, just bad officers and all that? In the absence of a bit more honesty from the club and its officials about what is wrong (and there may well be good reasons why this has to be so) it is inevitable that the finger will point to the coaching staff for at least part of the blame.

With that in mind, I would be ecstatic if the club could secure the services of an experienced, proven and TOUGH coach to come and try and sort out the shambles we see on the field, for the time being at least. Maybe taking some of the load of Macca at least for now. I suspect that with the necessary very lean structure at the club nowdays, Macca has too many responsibilities. I SUSPECT he is not tough enough with the players - and he certainly seems reluctant to drop under-performers - but maybe there are reasons why he can't be? Maybe we have more injuries than we are admitting to (like in 199icon_cool.gif? Maybe Macca IS out of his depth? Maybe we all know jack shît about what really goes on...?

And its all very well for folk to argue that the Bulls must be an attractive proposition to any prospective experienced coach, but why? No sugar daddy; no spare funds (and very tight on what we have); no new stadium (yet) and a track record of failed schemes; major player turnover before next season, much of which will finalise before any new guy can get his hands on things so it could be a couple of years before he can say its "his" squad; ongoing emnity with the Leeds club; collapsing fan base - if you choose to list all the negatives and pass by any positives then its hardly attractive, is it?

Why would an experienced guy risk his reputation and set himself up for a load of grief by coming here? For the challenge? Maybe, but he still has to feed his family. For the money, then? That would be the money we are rather short of then, especially with collapsing gates and any settlement to incumbent staff. Not that the economic realities cut much ice with many people angry with the situation - and, lets be fair, understandably so.

And please don't expect Macca to just walk without any compo - he has HIS family to feed in a very very uncertain profession. He won't have the luxury of just chucking his job in - and I challenge pretty well anyone on here to say they would do differently?

But remember please what Hood said at the Fans' Forum, in response to (my) question about the financial implications of falling gates - not worried about the profitability, but more worried about the cash flow. You don't go bust because you are not making profits; you go bust because you run out of cash. This board inherited a dreadful cash prognosis, and the history books will record how they saved the club and (hopefully) set it on a more sustainable (if unpalatable) financial footing - in my opinion. But all the options I see on here involve expending cash we don't have before we see corresponding cash inflows. How will that work, then?

Can folk on here explain how, as a household, they would find a way of spending a load of cash up front if they had no savings and no appreciable overdraft or other borrowing facilities? Cos that's what you are asking of the club. Anyone got an answer to that? There IS a way, of course - you sell some family silver or cut your expenditure even more - in this case, expenditure on players. It wouldn't be the first time. But what would folk say if or when we saw best players being sold and cheaper replacements? We had a "selling club" thread recently, did we not? Or, of course, you come into an inheritance from a rich relative. Which is basically what happened at clubs like Saints, Wire, Wigan, Hudds, Salford...but where are OUR rich rellies?

Regulars know I have been pedalling this argument for ages. Some, like one unpleasant guy recently, choose to accuse me of forcing my views on others as being the only acceptable view. That's nonsense - if you don't like what I say, don't read it - or better, improve on what I say with better arguments - that stand up financially as well as operationally. I hope there are better arguments, I really do, cos the conclusions I reach from my own arguments thoroughly depress me. I'm desperately hoping some of you guys do have some practicable answers or, more to the point, that the club does. Cos, short of a rich benefactor chucking a load of cash in, or some miraculous improvement on the park, I don't.

But I stress - it is very hard to comment objectively without knowing what is really going on behind the scenes - which I suspect is as always rather more than we are aware of.

But hey, what do I know and what do any of us know?

Great post Adeybull. But we've all continued to go along and pay our money for the last two seasons and seen standards drop. Eventually the Board must recognise that this is not going to continue. If there is a long term plan then the supporters should be let in on it along with milestones. Otherwise, to paraphrase a certain film, when other loyal supporters ask 'What is to become of the club?' the answer will be a loud 'Frankly, I don't give a damn'.

The single most articulate, balanced, all-encompassing and yet concise post on this issue.

(I particularly think the all too real issue of people including Macca needing to earn to exit is a very good one - maybe a few people on here are too indoctrinated in a football world where top players and coaches earn as much in 2 months as many of us earn in a career and can afford to quit easily on points of principle.)

Unless the Club wants to keep the Fans informed the Fans will speculate. It's not for us to come up with answers, that's what the Club pays the Coaching Staff to do. Unfortunatly the Coaching Staff seem devoid of answers despite 2-3 years of learning lessons whilst getting worse. An losing quality Players is the only thing we seem to be any good at. Should the Fans say nothing? Just turn up every week and accept the poor and pathetic performances and excuses?
We pay our money and have a right to speak our minds and vent our anger. How bad have things got when Season ticket holders are seriously considering having a barbeque, party, day out, whatever instead of turning up for a match they have already paid for?

As a fan, hard to argue with any of that. I made the point about a bit more honesty with the fans (as I have done before), and I'm sure you can see from what I said that I am not in any way condoning the current debacle of a position. Of course fans are expected to want to vent their anger - I am no exception in wanting to find someone responsible to bray hell out of. Except, worryingly and like more and more on here, I'm finding I'm just increasingly numb to it all. Both of your last sentences are highly pertinent.

But my point is...what if there ARE no quick-fix answers that the club can realistically afford? All the anger in the world is not then going to fix the problem. What then? That is my real concern. There must BE solutions, but I struggle to that see bringing in an expensive replacement coach is amongst the practicable ones - even if in an ideal world its the one most people now seem to believe is the only solution. Maybe I'm being too pessimistic and we WILL see a new man soon. Or maybe its Catch 22. Only the club can know the answer to that, and they ain't telling.

Adey I've made the point before and I'll make it again. Granted the club may not be able to afford to sack McNamara but the way things are going it will get to the stage tat we simply can't afford not too. The declining drop in gates should be worry enough but what sort have impact is this season going to have on season ticket sales I dread to think. IMO the only way to reengage the general attention of the AN Other fan is too replace the coach this would show that the club has still ambition.

If the Club wants to keep the Fans happy they need to make some changes. Some transparency and honesty would go a long way. Why the reluctance to announce new signings? Other clubs don't have a problem making the announcements early. Announcing all the leavers and waiting until after the season ticket deadlines are over to announce players does nothing to inspire confidence in the Fans.
Maybe the Club should have Fans forums on a more regular basis? One thing's for sure announcing any increase in season ticket prices without offering substantial signings and changes is not going to do improve matters and that is what I think we may be looking at.
I would also really like to see some consequences for all under-performing players, yes Platty is having a run in the reserves but there are more than him taking money under false pretences. If they can't play for pride you'd think winning bonuses would inspire them ( I remember Graham Bradley making some similar statement when asked what inspired a win from a losing position) We have some promising youngsters, let a few of them play each week until the end of the season and not 3 minutes at the end of a losing game.
If all else fails I suggest we have a competition to see who can provide the best in game entertainment. My first suggestion is we all bring Beach Balls to amuse the sleeping masses. Quite a few years ago I did suggest we had a beach party, sand, parasols, barbeques, loud shirts and white legs. The Club seems to have forgotten how to do stuff like this. We used to be inovators as well as a good Team.

If only we could change some of the existing player contracts to make them more performance-related, eh?

I understand that POV entirely. But you yourself have acknowledged (what may be) the Catch-22: can't afford to do it and can't afford not to. What's the answer? I know you don't know, and I sure don't. Does anyone?

Hindsight is a marvelous thing!......

A lot of things have changed and we as a Club don't seem to have adapted very well...
As a very clever person one wrote "Always look on the bright side of life" Maybe that's one for the Band to try this weekend, and if apt at any time ;
"It's time to play the music
It's time to light the lights
It's time to meet the Muppets on the Muppet Show tonight.

It's time to put on makeup
It's time to dress up right
It's time to raise the curtain on the Muppet Show tonight.

Why do we always come here
I guess we'll never know
It's like a kind of torture
To have to watch the show"

The last one seems very apt right now......Maybe I'm being harsh?

Getting a new coach in would at least renew some spark of hope in the future, would generate interest and provide a good reason to renew a season ticket - possibility is a marketable commodity.

As you freely admit we don't know precisely which is the worst option financially, but I would suggest continued poor performance coupled with an unmarketable product next season - 'Come and see us fail again under McNamara', is likely to be of more detriment financially than paying his contract up, or alternatively moving him back to assistant coach, youth development etc on a reduced salary, therefore also securing his capacity to feed his family etc, whilst bringing in someone new. Still costly but worth the punt, particularly if we can get an established coach.

I think the argument that nobody of any calibre would want the post is and always has been completely bogus for reasons repeated ad nauseum across many threads on this forum.

But I now believe that need to spend money is far greater because of the dwindling support than what it would cost to replace him.

A view I'm sure most on here now seem to share. But it still fails to answer the Catch-22 question of how could you replace him if you could not afford to? By which I mean you'd have to shell out cash well in advance of the improved income you expect to get, but you may not have much spare cash to shell out cos every penny is accounted for?

Its not trying to be clever - its a deathly serious question. One that many other non-sports businesses have had to contend with, as a result of first the credit crunch and then the resulting deep recession. And many who could not find the cash to take necessary actions fell, and are falling, by the wayside.

The money has to be found from somewhere if means the club offering some sort of share issue then so be. I know this seems drastic but if nothing changes and we go in to 2010 and we have a similar season as this year I honestly believe that we will have to get used to being a bottom half side for the foreseeable future.

Not surprised its you who has come up with the one obvious way of breaking the Catch 22. I deliberately kept quiet on this earlier to see if there would be any appetite for such action. Yup, that's the way to do it.

But (as always, there is a but...) the existing shares will have little effective value, so in the normal course of things the investors in the new shares would expect disproportionate voting rights through e.g. issuing the new shares at a deep discount - something the existing shareholders would likely not be at all happy with, I suspect. Plenty of ways round this, PROVIDED the new investors were prepared to recognise at inception that they'd be putting money in for not a lot in return. Fans might well do this, although to raise - say - £1/4m if 1,000 people were prepared to shell out would mean £250 per head. What you reckon?

Alternatively, issue debentures (secured loans) or preference shares to fans, like some soccer clubs do. That way, no dilution of ownership of the club, but at the expense of taking on debt which has a separate set of implications. Preference shares would be ideal from the club's POV, but probably the worst of all worlds for investors.

Soccer clubs issuing debentures usually do something like "invest x and you have your own special seat for y years", don't they?

I'm sceptical that enough fans could be persuaded to part with enough cash, especially in the current economic environment and with the poor poor form, but even so you have suggested a solution where no-one else yet has.

Or we find external folk with money to invest...which is what the club has been trying to do for years, of course.

Incidentally, Stains just issued a load of new shares - mostly to McManus & Co in exchange for directors' loans to the club, but also nearly £400k in a placing of new shares. Would that we could raise £400k in that way!

I Think you'd be shocked how many fans would be willing to take up any offer from the club. Also it's doesn't cost much for the club to put a few tentative feelers out amongst the fans to gauge the interest.