Best team I can pick out of that:

1. Sam Tomkins
2. Darrell Goulding
3. Michael Shenton
4. Ryan Atkins
5. Tom Briscoe
6. Gareth Widdop
7. Luke Robinson
8. Adrian Morley
9. Shaun Lunt
10. James Graham
11. Sam Burgess
12. Gareth Ellis
13. Sean O'Loughlin
SUBS
14. James Roby
15. Ben Westwood
16. Joel Tomkins
17. Stuart Fielden or Eorl Crabtree

With Burgess playing a bit of back row and a bit of front row.

I can't believe from that squad, the best 7 and starting 9 I can pick is Robinson and Lunt! Can't we clone Sam Tomkins to play fullback and Scrum Half?

Harsh leaving out Ryan Hall, but I feel he doesn't play as well without Senior inside him (oo er), and Briscoe & Goulding's form this year means they deserve the chance first. If one had a nightmare though, I'd have no problem with Hall coming in to replace them.

Yup, all shoe in's.

And of course we forget the captain, Jamie Peacock.

The Aussies have plenty of injuries, yet have depth right across the comp....because they clearly value producing homegrown players. Maybe the penny will drop over here in ten years.

So a lad who is deemed not good enough to play 7 for Huddersfield is the solitary scrum half in a touring party?

What has Steve Macnamara got against half backs? He didn't think we needed any at Bradford and he appears to have taken the same philosophy into the international set up. The one crumb of comfort is that Sykes hasn't been picked.

Looking at the squad we are taking over, I can't see us causing NZ or Aus much trouble in all honesty. I guess McNamara will take the majority of the flak though when we get turned over by the Kiwis and Aussies.

He's the one picking them to be fair, so deserves a fair chunk of either credit or flak depending on how it goes.

One thing that does occur to me.

If McNamara thinks all our players aren't good enough to play for England, why the f*ck did he sign them for Bradford in the first place? I appreciate you can't always sign internationals, but the fact he doesn't think that ONE of the squad he signed is good enough really makes you wonder.

Ryan Hall simply has to play. Best winger we have by some distance. Size, pace, strength and big game experience.

F*ck Lunt off. Simply play Roby for the 80, he's upto it and the "impact" hooker doesn't work at International level, the opposition forwards are too savvy and well rotated. The impact hooker works in SL because of the relative weakness of many benches given the Salary Cap restrictions.

My team:

Widdop
Briscoe
Shenton
Atkins
Hall
O'Loughlin
Tomkins
Moz
Roby
Graham
Ellis
Westwood
Burgess

Fielden
Harrison
Crabtree
Tomkins (and I'm yet to be convinced)

Either way, that side is troubling nobody.

I don't think the aussies depth is due in any way to them valuing home grown players. It's to do with the fact that in the areas of Aus where RL is popular, it IS the dominant sport, in much the same way that football is in the UK. So this leads to a much larger player pool. The population of the Aus where RL is at it's strongest doesn't have a vastly different number of people living there than the combination of Yorks, Lancs and Cumbria. But, because they don't have to deal with a financial behemouth like the Premier League, the NRL is able to attract the top young athletes in the area.

McNamara and his England side may very well take a kicking, but that's what happens when you put a team with 2 world class players up against teams with 17 world class players, with reserves trying to push their way into the starting 17.

And I believe he did say he was looking to take the best "team" rather than the best players

He is, but the pool of talent to pick from just isn't there. I'm struggling to pick a different squad which I think would result in a different set of results over there. I suppose at least we have a ready made scapegoat though.

He really doesn't have a clue, thank god we don't have to put up with him anymore at Bradford, just a shame he will now set back the England team by several years.

Without doubt elements of truth and logic there.

My point being is we have a large pool of "talent" right down to grassroots level but the obsession with anything antipodean being allowed to play for all our SL sides is a major hamstring in our international development, or lack of. Outstanding overseas players always benefit the comp. The concern is those "average" players getting in, again into nigh on every team. But then that goes back to the age old SL v Int debate. Ho hum.

While he doesn't have a great pool to pick from, there are better options than the likes of Robinson & Lunt. Sinfield & Burrow would definitely be improvements as halves than Robinson. As far as hookers go, while we have no top class ones any more, the likes of Clarke, Moore, Diskin & Higham are surely better options than Lunt!

No doubt we would rather have the likes of Kyle Eastmond out there, who is probably first choice No.7, and that's out of his hands. But a couple of those choices and a couple of omissions are just nuts.

In fact, the top 3 in that squad that I can't believe are in there, are all from the Giants. Not sure what to make of that (although no doubt their fans will believe the whole RL Community are biased against them for sharing a similar opinion).

Sinfield withdrew through injury. Burrow has had his opportunity and has done little at International level. Perhaps the hookers could have been different but I don't think there is a huge difference in quality between any of them. Perhaps he chose Lunt because he was going to go with Robinson at 7.

I'm not sure I'd have picked Griffin either but by the same token, the replacements are of a similar quality IMO.

I wasn't aware of that one, but that explains the most surprising name missing from the squad. That's actually good to know, as if he'd simply left him out it would be more amazing.

We'll agree to disagree on the others. I personally think other options are far better than Robinson & Lunt, and there are a couple above Griffin too.

Two big positives for me though are Fielden deservedly getting back in, and Richie Myler being left out.

Oh I hadn't even noticed Tony Clubb. Another massively overrated player. Always seems to have plenty of potential, never seems to show it.

I suppose putting a Londoner in there keeps the Southern lot and Journos interested though eh?

Completely agree. I look at the squad with a certain amount of trepidation but I suppose we (again) have to give him the benefit of the doubt until we crash out of the tournement in fourth place...!

However, when you look at the team, I suppose you have to take into account the fact that we're not working to the full salary cap this year and... oh... hang on...

There doesn't seem to be much international experience in the backs... I suppose he's been brought in to bring the younger players through and his legecy will be seen in years to come... I'm sure I've heard that before as well.

If, as has been suggested, this is the worst team to leave these shores (nothing like being positive! They'll probably go and win it now) is that a damnation on Macca or the players who he has available? A sign of the way this season has gone is the fact the the Rhino's have only one player representing them.

Everyone will come up with a different squad if they were asked to name one. Obviously McNamara will have more facts to hand to base his selections on. Who is carry injuries etc, who coped or didn't cope with the last tour. Huddersfield were in good form at the back end of the year which probably played a part in his thinking.

I don't agree with all the selections but at the same time there could be some reasons for those selections that I'm not aware of. I don't think the changes I would make in my imaginary team would make a significant difference to our chances though!

Does anyone apart from McNamara rate Griffin above the likes of Lynch, Scruton, Carvell, Coley or even Bailey?

The best I can pick from a bad bunch :

Widdop
Briscoe
Shenton
Atkins
Hall
Brown
Tomkins
Graham
Robinson
Morley
Ellis
Westwood
Burgess

Roby
Fielden
Harrison
J tomkins

Maybe he is being biased... let's face it we've been down to the bare bones at times this year and every player on more than one leg has had to do shed loads of work. So, he's doing us a favour in letting our guys have a rest!

Good call.

Would certainly bring some animal to the side and upset the oppo.

Probably upset James Graham more though...

Not saying hello to James Graham would probably upset him these days. He's turned into a petulant crybaby lately. Such a shame to see arguably the best prop in the league reduced to the moaning kn0bhead he's been in recent weeks, who was lucky not to be given 10 minutes in the Grand Final for his hissy fit.

I agree though about Bailey. As much as I can't stand the guy, he would have been another better choice than Griffin.

Bailey's had an excellent season - and he does his job well - Look at how he wound Radford up when Leeds played Hull.


If everbody was fully fit, what would your team be then?

Widdop
Briscoe
Bridge
Atkins
Hall
Tomkins
Eastmond
Peacock
Roby/Diskin ( England's worst position)
Graham
Burgess
Ellis
O'Loughlin - I only left him out of my other team by Mistake !!!!!

Roby/Diskin
Morley
Lynch
Fielden

Crabtree
J Tomkins
B Harrison
B Westwood
Shenton
Goulding
Burrow
This will be controversial - has Deacon retired from international????? Without Eastmond we are crying out for a 7.
Bailey

Bully Boxer makes a very valid point in that he speaks of Huddersfield being in form at the end of the season and players being picked on the back of that fact. Whilst I must admit I was surprised at the inclusion of Darrel Griffin, how many times have squads left these shores with players having been picked on reputation rather than being in form and gone overseas and got erm............... smashed. Now I am not saying that this tour will be different but isnt it right that players in form are given a chance?.

I personally for one wouldnt pick James Graham because he is a spoilt brat who acts like a four year old stamping his feet and back chatting the referee, the Aussie refs will have a field day if he repeats his antics whilst on tour.

As has been mentioned in this thread previosly everyone will have a view on the squad but picking players in form should always be the way.

You wouldn't pick the best prop we have?

No matter whether he moans to the ref or not, we need him.

If Sinfield was fit would you leave him out too? He's the biggest moaner in SL but he'd be a welcome addition to a poor England squad.

Bailey is a wind up merchant supreme. It's his job, is controlled with it and is actually exceptional at doing so. Would love to see him doing it for us and add the nasty element we lack.

Fully fit:

Widdop
Briscoe
Gleeson
Atkins (would still be Senior but he's retired)
Hall
McGuire
Eastmond
Moz
Roby
Peacock
Ellis
Burgess
O'Loughlin

Fielden
Graham
Burrow/Pryce
Westwood

I had considered Pryce as a centre given his size and handling skills and the lack of existing quality there.

James Graham is simply becoming a parody of himself. He needs to stop the dummy spitting, it's pathetic.