...unless, seemingly you're Warrington.... or Wigan when they need a personalised bespoke loophole creating to keep a player...

Anyway, the point is pointless as standards have declined substantially in the game even since 2006. Never mind current Saints being able to match Saints 2006 - I very much doubt any other team in the league would have given them a game either. You'd have to put together a "best 17" from all players around today to stand much chance of finding a current GB team that could have beaten Saints '06.

Makes depressing reading does'nt it? But it's just transisition look how low Bradford and Wigan have been after dominating. It's no good supporting them when they win everything if your not gonna bother when they have tough patches.

Perry might've made it in the props. He would've been around 24/25 and not sure on when he played for Aus but he has so he might have been still at international/SOO level.....maybe.....possibly...

You're right to an extent. Standards certainly have declined. I just looked back at that team and to see us recruit no-one of at least similar standard to the players we had is disappointing. Graham, Anderson and Lyon were complete one offs and unreplaceable in the 2012 climate. But to see the likes of Shenton, Flannery and Hohaia in place of Talau, Gilmour, Pryce, especially when two of those players are still running around (and are British) shows bad player selection.

Agreed that losing Gilmour seems ever stranger with every passing year. But as I've said many a-time, Shenton was by far the best centre out there at the time - he still is if he can reclaim form/fitness. I'd love to know who people think we could have signed instead who would have been any better... And as for Hohaia, clearly Pryce wanted too many years and £s for us to be able (or want to be able with his injuries) to pay and, with Eastmond being off, we were desperate for a half and Hohaia was just simply the best candidate available without a transfer fee. Again - who else was there available that, without the benefit of hindsight, we would have signed at the time instead? Those signings haven't worked out and our team has been lessened as a result, but it's more down to luck and timing and the fates and the inexorable decline in GB player quality than it is to the oft criticised Saints recruitment policy.

Ryan Atkins?

He went a year before Shenton and so isn't directly comparable, and (depending on who you believe) we intended to play Sia and Gidley in the centres for that season instead, so you can't really complain about poor recruiting there (we couldn't have known at the time how badly Gidley was going to fall off in that last year). We'dve had to have competed with Warrington's accountants to get him too so would have had little chance in that department... Given a choice 2 years ago I'dve taken Shenton ahead of Atkins anyway.

In fairness, I was happy with the signing at the time. I think it was less a case of bad recruitment and more a case of a promising youngish player who has failed to live up to his promise.

I bet if Billy Slater was playing full back we wouldn't be having these discussions about Shenton.

If Shenton is struggling for confidence and we absolutely [imust [/iplay him then I'd seriously consider pushing him out to the wing.

But we've signe Hohaia to a 4 year deal and he wouldn't be upping sticks from overseas for peanuts. In hindsight (which is a wonderful thing) a 3 year deal for Leon on the money Hohaia is on would have been a much better option.

Shenton had a good finish to last season but looked fairly ordinary at the start of the season and mediocre at best this year. Had we kept Leon, we could have looked at a quota player for the centre.

The problem with Shenton is that to a certain extent Saints have de skilled him. Very rarely gets any quality ball even worse this season with no half back play. Shenton most of the time gets lateral dead end ball with the defence well up on him with no space to work. We dont chip through into space for him to run into because we don,t have a skilful kicker, we don,t create a dummy runner to give him an inside ball because we don,t have half backs with skilful play. Shenton looks frustrated more than anything due to the teams inconsistency and lack of game plans.

No, none of that counts as you well know - he's just a completely **** player, it's his own fault he never gets any ball and we should have signed any of dozens of other top centres that were available instead on much less money.

With my Warrington bias hat on, I would say....... Warrington Wolves version 2011 would have beaten them.

Taking my Warrington bias hat off, I would say....... Warrington Wolves version 2011 would have beaten them.

I was spitting mad at Leon going, but we don't know all the circumstances so the whys and wherefores are all just idle speculation that won't get us anywhere. Given that he and Cashmond were on the way then we were left in a frankly pretty desperate situation a year ago. 4 years for a utility back to be your main half was a crazy move and many of us questioned it at the time, but maybe Saints simply just didn't have an awful lot of alternatives. Wigan are having to sign Matty Smith for chrissakes - nothing more about the dire state of halfback talent in this league needs to be said than that.



I've said it before - put Paul Newlove in a Saints #3 shirt now and he'd look ordinary. If we'd spent all our spare cap and quota space on a top Aussie centre he'd look ordinary too. Centre is not our big problem area. Halfback most definitely is.

Ah yes, the all-conquering 2011 Wolfs side that stood head and shoulders above all other teams and swept all before them in an unstoppable tide cleaning up all the trophies on the way.





ah....

I could ALMOST buy into this - if it weren't for the fact that Josh Jones has looked more than useful at centre with the same quality of service. The big difference is Jones [iactively looks for the ball[/i and if it isn't moving his direction he will hunt closer to midfield. Shenton might as well be on rails for all the lateral movement he undertakes.

But Shenton doesnt get the same quality of service,the ball is so slow going right compared to going left and added to this Sia is the right 2nd row and the ball doesnt get past him.More or less every time Shenton gets the ball its been so slow to get to him that he has no room to work.

Jones has played ON THE LEFT and has seen a tiny little bit of ball... Shenton has played ON THE RIGHT and so has seen none... And 'round and 'round the circular argument goes....

Having at least three separate cases of frostbite because Saints went cheap on the stadium I'm perfectly aware where Jones has played. Possession through the backs has been poor across the board. There is no grand conspiracy to keep Shenton off the ball.

It's pointless trying to compare both teams...the 2006 team was full of top class players and the look at the time was very ambitious.

The 2012 team is very average and lacks ambition.

Absolutely, you give the ball to your best players. Shenton may have had a little service, but if he went looking for it or did something with it when he does receive possession, he would see more of it. Look down the years at some of our classy Centres who have received plenty of ball because you knew they'd do something with it - Newlove, Iro, Lyon, Gidley etc. Quality players create magic, Shenton doesn't.

I can't believe anyone hasn't mentioned the biggest difference in those 2 teams and it's not a player .apollo perellini the fitness coach had them supremely fit and the difference in the levels of the 2006 team and this one is staggering.it costs nothing and you only need to look at the Wigan team now and how it pays dividends .it has transformed , in my opinion an average group of players into one of the leagues best.

And look at the halves they played along side,there is the reason they got better ball and good look good.Shenton isnt a bad player he just needs quicker ball and he isnt going to get it with the halves we have now.

Can't argue with this to be honest.

hummmmm