I suppose only time will tell, but I believe the English game is kidding itself if they think that the current crop of young players will grow into a team that can compete with Australia.

I my opinion the Aussie’s could field two teams capable of beating England (QL & NSW), until we have a comp like the state of origin series we will always be behind.

Bear in mind origin has other nationalities in it. Has played with NZ players and PNG players in it.

They are young and half backs get better with age and experience.

really enjoyed sundays game thought the ref was rubbish for both sides as per usual, thought saints were superb seeing as they were missing some top players but credit to the robins we battled to the end... also thought saints away following was excellent as well......

Eastmond out played Dobson totally on sunday.

Im surprised Dobson made it out of Eastmonds back pocket.

was the same when he played against Sam. Considering they are 1 trick ponies they didnt do bad against 'the best 7 in England'

But mainly Aussie’s, and even taking that into consideration both would probably beat England.

Could we say hand on heart that a Yorkshire or Lancashire team could even compete with Australia?

We are not producing enough world class players, the only one we have is Sam Burgess in my opinion.

It’s not good enough, and until we stop and look at our selves as a sport in this country we will never produce players of the same ilk as the players that are available to Australia.

You only have to look at players like Orford, have we ever had in the last 10 years a player of his class that has not played for England?

But, Australia has a huge pool of players. In the UK its a second rate game and cannot attract people from other areas. I mean in the second tier nearly every player is semi pro. So you talk about 30 players in each squad (approx) x 14 teams is 420 players and a majority of that is foreign. Now in Aus, you have large squads and a good quality second tier league. In NZ the game is second rate to Union and we can compete with them as they have a small pool also. Its about numbers and averages.

Until we get rid of the cap and are aloowed to spend more money we will not get better players. We can get world class players from Aus to play and bring through these youngsters. I know Barrett did it with Tomkins and can only be good for the youngsters to be mentored by the class players instead of over the hill and average aussies.

Why, was the salary cap not in place when Barrett came over?

The communist cap is also the cause of childhood obesity.. and over 20% of road accidents in the north of England alone.

You say that Eastmond is a one-trick pony and then say Dobson would walk into the England side. What about Dobson being a one-trick pony? It's not like he's that great a threat taking on the line and although he has a decent passing game it's hardly world beating. He's got a good kicking game I'll give him that.

lol but I have to correct you because it's the competition cap not the salary cap

Yes, so 1 class player....do keep up.

That is exactly my point, we have no English world class half backs.

I think you're being a bit too quick to write off Eastmond and Tomkins given their respective ages. Thurston was hardly the complete player at the same age and look at him now. There's no knowing how well Eastmond and/or Tomkins will develop yet.

It wasn't the halves that let England down in the deciding match against Australia.

So, what are you advocating then? Cap space for 4? 5?

The fact is, most 'World-Class' Australians don't reject Super League because of a lack of pound signs, but because they won't be eligible to play for the national team whilst playing here. Barrett came over because he was coming towards the end of his career and wasn't first choice for his country, the salary cap has absolutely nothing to do with your argument.

Thats not the point!!!

Que?

Let's look at the facts. Both Eastmond and Tomkins played blinders against a fearsome Australian team (one of their best). Indeed, at times both gave their illustrious counterparts fits. Neither cost England a match. We blew it in the outside backs.

Players who outplay world class opponents are - by definition - world class. Period.

Course it is, Was Matt King an Aussie international when he signed. He came for the £££. Cap space for "how ever many you can afford" should be the answer. Its not a big factor not playing for Australia as there are plenty of world class players in oz who will not get a sniff so dont care Orford being one.

Spot on.

I should have mentioned this earlier (I've been keeping away to retain what shreds of sanity I possess) but an old (and usually reliable) contact from Usenet days who works in the Aussie media told me there was a hell of a lot of NRL interest in both Eastmond and Tomkins around the time Eastmond signed his two year deal. Preliminary contact was made with Eastmond by at least one club. He is certain that Tomkins will receive a massive NRL offer when his contract is up. Ditto Eastmond, but there is a lot of Union interest too. Which is problematic because even the NRL can't outbid the rugger buggers.

I don't have a problem with either going down under. I'm sure they'll do fine. But if Eastmond goes to Union (and I have a nagging suspicion that he might) I'll jump off a cliff.

Why don't you have a problem with Eastmond going down under? I do. I want him to stay here and enhance the British game, with Saints.

The NRL is like the Premiership compared to Super League being the Championship. The best talent should be playing in the best competitions IMO.

I don't want to see Eastmond go either. But we have to be realistic. Class players are in demand and there are agencies out there who can offer the kind of money and lifestyle that Saints cannot. The protracted contract negotiations with Kyle suggest to me that whilst he is prepared to give his all for the club - he is also smart enough not to rule out options that could well set him up for the rest of life. And I don't blame him. League is a rough game. He could rupture an Achilles tomorrow and be on the scrapheap thereafter - no money, no job, no means of supporting himself.

Look, if it comes down to a bidding war with another SL team then yes - break the bank. The fans would torch the new stadium if he went to the Pies. But if the NRL is serious about taking him we will struggle to keep hold. I mean, if you were faced with a choice of McManus or Russell - let me introduce you to my Hollywood pals - Crowe you'd be crackers not to get on the plane.

If he goes to the NRL at least we have the consolation that he'll become ten times the player he is now and will shaft the Kangaroos royally come the internationals.

So taking as many money hungry imports as the budget allows, who are willing to shelve there international career and play in an inferior league in the process, will help our youngsters develop (when they aren't keeping half of the youngsters out of the team, that is)?

Wiganer in 'communist cap' obsession horror. But back to the subject....

If Eastmond wanted to play in the NRL I would be delighted for him, as long as we put a clause in his contract for if he ever came back. Great idea in principle, like other successful small print such as the case of Adrian Morley and Iestyn Harris