Only the very top sides will be able to live with our pack next year if we keep our props fit. It's back to almost 2006 levels. That won't necessarily win us any trophies, but it will mean that we'll be there or thereabouts. Hopefully there's still a signing or two to be announced in the backs.

Wigan will be stronger on paper. It'll be interesting to see how a lot of their players being involved in the internationals affects them, and also how they get on after the initial McGuire novelty factor has worn off slightly. Whatever effect that has, they'll still be competing for honours.

Warrington have the best squad on paper, I reckon. Big front row, mobile and aggressive back row, strike in the threequarters and guile in the halves. They've sorted out their one obvious weakness by getting rid of Mathers, and got themselves a top class goalkicker in the process.

The top three will be those clubs, but in what order who knows? Leeds will have to do some recruiting if they want to join in, otherwise they'll be in a slightly lower tier with Hudds and HKR in my opinion.

We have sold more season tickets for Widnes than we did for the last season at Knowsley road.

We normally have around 6000 season ticket holders So i think your expectation of only 4k is way off the mark.
I suspect it will end up more like 7-8k on lesser games, with an average of probably around 9k for the year as a whole.

I'm not normally a season ticket holder, but I intend to get one for next year for two reasons

1) Widnes is easier for me to get to, since I live in south liverpool.
2) I want to try and support the club through this difficult period of homelessness.
(I also missed more games than I'd have liked this season, due to other commitments).

Well, I'm a first time season ticket holder even though I haven't missed a home game in four years. I wanted to secure a seat at Widnes, it being smaller than Knowsley Road.

As for my prediction:

1. Saints
2. Warrington
3. Huddersfield
4. Crusaders

I know its stating the obvious, but finishing in the top four will be highly dependant on teams coming through the season with minimal injuries. But i`ll go for:-

1) Wigan.
2) Warrington.
3) Saints. [size=50(I do think that playing in an atmosphere that stinks of poo will have an adverse affect on your players).[/size


4) Leeds.

Also have a sneaky feeling that if their new signings can gell in the first couple of games, Salford will be up there at the business end of the season, (not in the top Four though)

1. Wigan
2. Leeds
3. Warrington
4. Bradford

Saints/wigan
saints/wigan
warrington
hudds

I think our pack next year will be the best in super league even tho we could do with a good loose forward.

The backs will be alot better if we can get pryce and kyle on the field together for most of the season. Shenton will also add much needed speed outwide.

I can't see gardner being first choice winger next year so i'd expect lomax to be on wing so the backs look to have more speed next year than this year if all stay fit.

Look at this
Fielden
Tommy
Coley
Hansen
Tomkins
Lockers
Lima
Mickey Mac
Prescott
Hock
Hoffman
Mossop
O'Carroll
Farrell
Tuson


Add in Ben Davies and I would think that is the best pack squad by in Superleague.

And?

Do YOU think that Saints can match that strength in depth?
Wasn't that what I intimated, or do I have to spell everything out for you?

Your pack was well beaten on Saturday night, now add Lima, Mossop, Hock & Hoffman to that pack and it will take some beating.

There are a lot of wild optimists on here!

Let me be pessimistic for a change.

I think our position in the league depends on several factors not least the fitness of Eastmond and possibly more importantly the make up of the Squad. There are a LOT of rumours flying around surrounding James Graham and Leon Pryce and keeping these two at the club is about as important as anything that has happeded with the squad in years. I can't stress how important they are and if we do loose them along with the amount of other changes we have had then we could be in trouble and out of the top 4.

I know many people will think I'm over-reacting but; new coach, playing in a strange ground, the loss of KC and the some other good players coupled with the potential loss of the two mentioned above fill me with dread!

Apart from that top three if we keep the squad together!!!

Like i said on a thread on CW, our front row could probably stand up to any in the world, and definitely the best in superleague, your backrow is better, and your strength in depth is impressive, they must all be working for peanuts

Dry roast in fact.

Saints pack will be nowhere near that of Wigans.

Wigans train at Orrell and Saints will be training at Cowley. So yes you are right they will be miles apart.

Wigan avoided our pack in the grand final. Maguire knew that Wigan had the advantage in the backs and the halves rather than the forwards.

What? Wigan smashed the Saints pack in the final, granted we scored our points out wide but we'd have never got those chances had we not fronted up and beaten the Saints pack.

I thought the packs were fairly even.

The difference lay in Tomkins returning the ball exceptionally well following our poor kicking performance giving you better field position to work from.

You pack was driving you towards our 20m line starting from your 40m line, ours was getting us to the half way line from our 10m line.

Fair enough. I just dispute the statement "Wigan avoided our pack in the grand final". I think that's far from the truth.

Top four for 2011.

Wigan
Saints
Hudds
then either Leeds or Wire.

I'd agree with you, if your pack hadn't fronted up we'd have bashed you all over the place.

Without peeing on your Fire, hoffman don't really want to be here and not great, lima ain't even first choice for kiwis, hock ( if he's back fir pies) ain't played rugby for 2yrs.

The list you've put earlier in the thread don't send any fear really. Fielden had 1 good year in 4yrs, coley, hanson, tuson, Prescott, Mick mac are all average.

You can't rite our pack off from the cup final display, our pack has been awesome this year and also been better than yours over the course of the year.

We've probably sold around 3000 '5 year season tickets' plus the annual renewal ones!!!! So I hardly think attendances will drop from 9500 average if not higher, to a paltry 4000!! I think we'll average at least 7500 even at Widnes.

Oh right, there I go being all pessimistic.

Do you think that Ashurst, Magennis and Dixon are better than Farrell, Tuson and Mossop, or that Wilkin is better than Tomkins or Hansen?

Look at the strength in depth. Injuries WILL happen to all sides, and I believe Wigan packwise are in a better position than any other team cover for them.

It's not like you at all is it

We'll see who is closest. 4000 or 7500+.

Saints to scrape 4th I reckon. Further transition next year and I think it will take a while for Simmons to sort us out and get us playing well.