I get them for free once a year, i'll happily sell you my copy for £2k !

Erm, I don't care.

Well Mr Shareholder, are we?

we are indeed, just one or two less than Eamon

Buy a couple more and sort the club out please?

But it still doesn't really tell you what he wants to know.

If i won the euro millions tomorrow i honestly think i couldnt do a better job than our current boss, i'd probably spring for a heli pad at the new gaff and get Jonathan Thurstons Mrs a £500k/yr job keeping it free of dust

I hear that Billy Slater's mum is a brilliant cook, some may say her services are worth upto £350k a year.

We are overpaying for some players then. I suppose this is what happens in the NRL too though. Team wins trophies, everyone wants paying more because they are champions, players end up leaving.

Hmm its a tough one, in theory we are paying the current squad the same as the 2006 squad, so by that measure we are well overpaying our current players. However about half the teams in superleague are spending up to the cap, yet we've not missed out on the grand final in 5 years, so by that measure we're getting good value. Nothing is clear cut.
Add to that that Roby and Graham were probably on junior (ish) contracts in 06 and Lyon was playing for far less than his market value and that could explain our dominance that year.

I don't think Saints are spending anywhere near the cap. Indeed, I reckon we could be in or near the bottom third for total wage bill in SL.

I think we're scrimping and squeezing every last penny for the ground and McManus is telling everyone we're spending high because we can't afford to lose ANY season ticket revenue.

We had four world class players in the squad in 06 in Lyon, Long, Cunningham and Scully, and a pack strong enough to leave Fozzard and Anderson out of final squads. We now have Graham and Roby and kids filling the squad past the first 13.

We were getting good value, but are we this year? I think that there are probably a similar number of average players in there, but there are far more kids expected to be first teamers, and I don't think it's them taking up all the cap space.

What and the hundreds of shareholders, who are mostly small holders and fans like myself choose not to tell anyone?

Its definite not as good value as our 2006 squad, of that there can be little arguement, but is it good value compared to the other top 7 squads?

The problem is that it's getting worse and even though I agree with the aim of replacing from within with youth, I'm not sure the players coming through are good enough to take over.

I'm not sure it is a better squad than Wigan, Wire, Leeds and Hudds though. There are players that are individually better, Roby, Graham, etc. But is Gardner better than Lawrence or Cudjoe? Is Meli? Is their coach just getting more out of his players than ours is?

Of course it could just be the competition evening itself out as more teams spend up to the cap, and that can only be good for the game.

I think think it is about evening out, which unfortunately means the very top teams like us are going to get worse.

I'm sure we have our fair share of high-earners i.e. Pryce, Wellens, Graham, Wilkin and Roby . But if we are right up at the cap - and given the hefty number of inexperienced kids playing first team football - we either have to believe that McManus (arguably the most financially astute man in SL) has chosen to grant them all pay deals that are above and beyond the market rate for their level of achievement or he's not telling the truth.

Don't forget that it was McManus himself who stated over two years ago that we needed to cut our cloth accordingly in order to secure the stadium - which meant getting rid of the experienced high-earners and going with less expensive (but precocious) academy lads. If we're bang on the cap then what's happened to the cost-cutting? What was the point of getting rid of, say, Willie Talau (when we couldn't afford to) if we were just going to carry on spending like were champions?

I'll go back to the point about paying over the odds for our kids. If we are doing precisely that then what happens when all of them mature (as they all will in the next 18-24 months) and improve dramatically? If we're up at the cap we won't be able to give them any kind of pay rise and they'll be off double-quick. I suppose we could pay them more if Wellens retires or Meli leaves. But if we pay them with that money what's left over to replace Wellens and Meli?

It just doesn't add up.

Under the cap rules, if a player is long serving (can't remember the exact number of years) doesn't only half their salary count towards the cap?
If so, we are trying to replace KC, Scully and Longy on half the wages we were actually paying them.

Chill Frosties. It's not even our board. If someone came on SS shouting the odds he'd get chased off the board with axes!

Nope. There is 50 grand that can be a reduction on players wages with over 10 years service. Thats 50 grand in total not each player. But you could spend it on one or many players with over 10 years.

The rhinos have sini, senior, Jjb, Bailey, burrow, McGuire. Disco goo until he moved on.

So say senior who will be on reduced terms, may only be taking up 20 grand on the cap but getting 70K but no reduction on anyone else.

This is correct, at Warrington we have Jon Clarke, Lee Briers and Paul Wood all with more than 10 years service but we are only allowed £50,000 in total spread across one or more players.

Seems a shame really that if a player stays at a club for ten years then the club should be given an incentive to keep him on the cap by allowing £50,000 for each player.

There is also (as an extra to the 10 year allowance) a £50K allowance for the top earner who has come through your academy system.
I would guess Roby at Saints, Burrow or McGuire at Leeds, O'loughlin at Wigan, Paul Wood at Wire.

We are not scrapping the barrel with our kids as some doom mongers would suggest


1. Wellens (1st choice)
2. Gardner (1st choice)
3. Shenton (1st choice)
4. Wheeler / Lomax (1st choice)weirdly enough
5. Meli (1st choice)
6. Gaskell
7. Wheeler / Lomax
8. Perry (1st choice)
9. Roby (1st choice)
10. Graham (1st choice)
11. Flannery (1st choice)
12. Puletua (1st choice)
13. Moore (2nd choice but not youth player anymore international hooker with many years of experience at SL)

14. Clough (1st choice)
15. Ashurst
16. Magennis / LMS
17. Foster (should be on the field IMO, but a kid all the same)

So I make that 11 first choice players. We are hardly in a war with this casualty list.

Dux and I watched a game from last year on record t'other week, and the line up whas very ropey. We're doing alright, I just think the amount of shuffling round messrs Wheeler/Lomax/Eastmond/Gaskell/ Foster have done over the past 2 years has meant that we don't really know (or perhaps are confident in knowing) what our actual starting line up should be.

Maybe not scraping the barrel overall, but the above is the real negative.