Hohaia did the same last week. It's not his defence that is a problem. In fact, the team's defence is good (bar against kicks, but that's been a problem at Saints for years). It's in attack that we are hopeless.

We were the same last season but with Robes and Jammer on board we could still pull off wins, although with a number of losses and draws in there too. I think we were about seventh in the table this time last year.

Top coach just needs time.All will come good.

Is that a serious post or you taking pi$$?

I'd like to see his missed tackle and penalty count too though. There was one passage of play in the second half where he let Ben Jefferies waltz through a non-existent gap next to him, then threw a forward pass to cost us possession then conceded two penalties in a row for high shots.

Fair enough but, I think the 2 high shots he got penalised for were harsh decisions. Silverwood seemed to give a few penalties for high shots which, in my view, were not.

After tonight it looks bleak, but even so I don't think a sacking is in order just yet.

Perry, Laffranchi, Puletua need to get a grip and lead from the front - Lomax/Wheeler, Gaskell, Hohahia, Wilkin need to work out how to create an attack and feed Meli and Shenton.

Certain players should be threatened with the sack if they don't pull their fingers out. If the coach can't sort them out over the next few weeks, he should answer for that.

Foster can't play against Leeds, Wolves and Pies. We'd be better with Clough or Dixon on the wing.

The performance WAS bad. For two weeks I've been texting friends saying we've reverted to the days of Eric Hughes. But bad as things are we need to retain some perspective. I know I'm as guilty as anyone so this is somewhat ironic. I guess it's part of - eventually - growing up.

Hohaia doesn't deserve anything like the stick he's getting. The guy has barely had time to settle in and we know from experience it sometimes takes anywhere up to 12 months for that to happen (which it did with Talau). Wheeler, Gaskell and Foster are similarly taking more than their fair share. Wheeler is older, but injuries have set his career back by at least sixteen months. Gaskell hasn't physically matured and Foster looks mentally shot.

If we are to point the finger of blame at players we should look no further than the experienced pros who have badly let the side down. Wilkin has really, really let us down. He is the obvious replacement as leader and go-to guy in times of strife and so far he's been completely anonymous. Puletua looks physically gone. Wellens - every attacking move ends with him etc. etc.

Of course, Royce deserves some stick. But if he's culpable then McManus must be also. After all, he's presided over player selection these past few years with some absolutely awful decisions (Meli, Gardner - even Wellens).

Which you haven't.



You're certainly "right" in the Charlie Sheen sense of being right i.e. endlessly repeating your "rightness" until someone crazy enough agrees with you or says the same purely to shut you up.

I thought Laffranchi had a half decent game tonight. Granted, his best work came running out wide like a second rower, which he is.

I take it you happy with this seasons performances?

Do you think it was correct to sign a fullback on as a replacement for a scrum half and the fullback ain't played in the halves for about 10 years?

Do you think it was correct to replace one of the best props in the world with a backrow who'd had next to no experince at prop?

Do you think it's a good idea to play 16 v 17 most weeks?

Do you think we looked well coached?

Do you think only playing one practice game was a good idea when trying a new combination of two fullbacks in the halves?

Do you think it's good that we rotate are wingers most weeks?

Do you agree that when most teams was slugging out in a long tough preseason that Royce had us resting at home?

Do you think it's great that we have lost more games at LP than we've won?

I'll ask again. Who do you know that is:

(a) Immediately available.

(b) Will definitely do a better job?

And I mean [uknow[/u, not speculate.

Because if, as I suspect, then answer is 'no-one' or 'I don't know' then it proves that there's a reason why Eamonn hasn't and will not react as per 99.9% of the people on here who post emotional nonsensical tripe. Everything I read on here is panic, sheer panic.

Seasons are won and lost in September/October, not March.

Don't waste my time.



I don't know what terms Royce offered Hohaia. There are rumours of this and that. But no evidence. Am I happy we signed an experienced - not to mention relatively young - player with proven big-match performance who can play in several positions? Yes.



Best props in the world are by definition nigh-on impossible to replace. As for signing Laffranchi - a) I have no idea who was *truly* available, b) we've signed experienced back-row forwards in the past who've made outstanding props (Fairleigh) c) Laffranchi is widely regarded in the NRL as a very good player and d) it's too early to judge him.



Based on performances so far this tactic is problematic. However, the *reasoning* behind playing 16 vs 17 is to spare the players for the playoffs. It is therefore a good idea to wait until the playoffs to judge whether it is effective.



We're losing so no. But I see coaching as less of an issue than the complete lack of a single effective scrum half and no leader on the pitch.



Irrelevant. We don't have a scrum half so we could play a dozen friendlies and it would make no difference.



I consider wingers the least important players in the modern game.



This is a statement of fact. It's like saying "do you agree the sun rises in the morning?"



Now you're being ridiculous. Pick the dummy up, son.

Surprised Hohaia is coming in for some stick, I thought he was one of your most dangerous players going forward. I was genuinely surprised how lacking in confidence St Helen's appeared to be. On the plus side I thought your defence looked pretty solid and held out for some long periods of pressure. A better decision by Foster in the 2nd half and you might well have ground out a result.

Some tough fixture coming up now for Saints which must be a concern. I am sure you'll find some form soon enough though and will still comfortably reach the top 8.

Forget all the doubters and the jibes from other clubs Saints fans. You are going through what every team that has a big change in where they play go through. But the joke about the Stobart trailer is funny and could be related to the roof at your new place. Your scrum half tonight made some bad decisions. Chin up boys and girls.

I'll answer this too, I'm pretty bored.

Serious post as Royce has a very good background, and Tony Smith started bad and look now one of the best coaches in rugby league.At the moment Lavatory Park but soon be a Fortress Park.

How the hell would I know who's available?

It's the clubs job to know or find out, not mine.

All I know, we can't continue to go like this. We played a poor bulls team 9 playsrs out injured who hadn't won at home and we lost.

Weve also been beat by a injury hit hull kr and Catalan team and struggled against Salford at home and London away, teams are putting scores on these for fun.

Something has to give mate.

I take it you didn't see what the wests fans was saying when we announced he was our head coach?

Utter rubbish! Your happy we signed a fullback to play halfback? Hahahaha great stuff.

The was many props off contract last season. Jason king, kite, griffin, Gil dudson, Lauaki, kafusia (spelling), Luke bailey plus other I can't think off.

You comment on that fact it's not coaching and down to the jack of a scrum half, then maybe if he signed one on instead of a fullback we'd not be in this mess!

Used to. Live in East Manchester nowadays.

From a Bradford fan's perspective this sounds like a discussion we were having 5 years ago ie, just a temporary slump vs critical decline. The latter was true and the failure to see what was happening has made for a truly tortuous few years. Saints are nowhere near as bad as we got but there are obvious problems which are not just 'form' related.

Firstly Bradford are not a poor as some on here are making out. We're not top 4 but we are improving particularly in the back row where we outworked Saints.

The lack of a scrum half in the absence of Roby is obvious. The conditions didn't suit Wheeler and Gaskell who are both good on their feet but your attack lacked basic structure. Jeffries played well by keeping it simple but he was partnered by Sykes who did OK but is not even a halfback.

Perry, Laffranchi, Clough, TP is not good enough as a front four. Your squad doesn't have enough props and particularly enough young English props a la Emmit who went to cas. For the money he'll have wanted it was a mistake to let him go.

Whoever is in charge of recruitment and retention has simply got it wrong. Too much money in overseas players and marquee signings like Shenton, and not enough young English forwards to form a core group. Nevertheless you have very good players. Lomax, gaskell and Wheeler need sticking with as they'll get better. Wilkin, who some on here criticise is an excellent player.

To sum up things are not as bad as some are making out but there are issues. The key one is the mcManus' judgement might just be starting to slip. If Simmons is partly responsible for starting the season without a 7 then he's partly to blame.

To sack or not to sack that is the question. I looked at the table last year, we lost 7 and did not beat Wigan or Warrington in the regular rounds.

We have to play Wigan and Warrington 5 times this year. Without counting Leeds that puts us up to 9 losses. No one can predict the future, our defence has tightened. But we can't play half a RL game. Defense will keep you in games, but it won't actually win games. The philosophy that defence wins games, is so wrong it's unreal. You can't defend for 80 mins and win. As a bradford fan said, we looked like we where playing well in the forwards and then it dropped off. Well thats Huddersfield and Hull all again. If the forwards are making headway, holding the territory, but then there is no result from that, that's when the lack of confidence kicks in.

I do not subscribe to the Saddened maddness, over our playing squad, but neither do I subscribe to the everything will come well in October theory. Quite frankly, I don't care about October. It's one game, I don't want to see a team back loading the season, prepared to lose half their games, to be fit for October. It's insane. Fans go week in and week out and whilst Trophies give you bragging rights, the week in week out wins and losses are what really impact on fans decisions to buy season tickets. If I was supporting a team the purposefully backloads their season, well quite frankly they can go sing for their supper for the first 15 games. If they aint bothered about preparing a proper season, then I won't pay to watch a full season.

We are not Leeds from last year, we don't have our 2 most influential players out, (yes Roby missed the last 2, but this rot set in way before).. When you look at the comments from Royce, he is quick to mention Roby being back next week, well that may help keep the score down but he is not a God and will not wave a magic wand and defeat Leeds on his own.

In the end the coach has to take the hit for player selection (backs on the bench) he does not use this to keep us fresh for the playoffs as he kept the policy (although I would now call it dogma) in the playoffs and the GF.

Not getting a prop - criminal . It's ok saying we have pushed backrowers forwards, but this has been done with too many of our current props. You can promote 1 maybe 2 backrowers, but you need a core of 3 or 4 props to do this.

Lance in at half back. Sorry but just wrong, decent player that he maybe not what we needed if we were replacing Wellens than fair enough, but he was coming in to cover the wrong players

I agree with all of this but I can't seem to make the point clear that we are in deep $hit due to this years recruitment.

We at least one prop but where is he going to come from? Our quota is full and with no British players off contract available then I can't see how we can bring a prop in.

Also, the halfback problem IMO is the biggest problem at the club but again, where is the new halfback coming from?

Lance might drop to fullback in coming season when wello calls it a day but that still leaves us short in the halves.

I expect Meli to go at the end of the season along with with flannery so effectively they need replacing in order to keep the squad. So add that to the props we need, the halfback we need means we are looking for 5 players with no quota spots.

The next coach has got one hell of a job on his hands and the next appointment has to be correct or we will find ourselves as a non play off team.

Evrything you have said there is spot on.There was no fluidity between the halfbacks and on numerous occasions the ball went to ground.Also the fitness of the team looks poor.Compare that to the likes of the wigan team(Who i think man for man are not as good as us)there is no comparison ,they are miles fitter than us .How many times were plays screaming out for a quick play of the ball or a player trying his best to get up quickly to play it but it never happened .Slow cumbersome and devoid of any real gameplan is how i see this team and until these areas are addresed saints will sytruggle.

If you are talking about a prop for this year then I fear we have missed the boat, as you say everyone is signed up. There are possibles but none of them as good as getting a prop at the normal time of year. We would have to be looking towards a loan, a player not playing well for another SL club, or someone playing well who we can, steal from a NL1 side. None of these are ideal options and it may well be better to struggle onwards for the rest of the season.

However if we are light in the pack, we could share the load more. Take yesterday, drop the back on the bench in Ashe and put Megennis on. It would give us more forward grunt in numbers if not in quality.

Halfback wise well we've just let too many go too quickly, Long, Smith, Eastmond, Ellis. The rot for me set in telling Long and Ellis and Smith to go, before we signed up eastmond long term. At that point Eastmond could pick his contract which put us with a 2 year contract with no chance of getting him for the next years.

Gaskell and Lomax can play halfback, but as Long says if they are being coached one way, they are unlikely to say, hey lets scrap this and play some different plays. Halfback can be recovered as they are young and can adapt, but the coach needs to coach the plays.

It's not impossible to turn this season into a better one, and not impossible for a new coach to bring in new players next year, but we have to get in first. If maguire taught us anything, it was a coach can take a top 8 side and make them a table topping side with 1 addition.