Straight after he confirmed he was leaving for Saints yes.

Rouges I think you may be doing Brown an injustice here, he has realised that finishing top is the poisoned chalice.

He has set his sights on finishing 4th or with a bit more effort even 5th.

If the unthinkable did happen,and saints won the gf wouldn't that mean they weren't the true champions.

McManus, Mike Rush and the coach decide which players to recruit. Brown is safe because McManus said when he appointed Brown that it was only Brown he was after. Foolish not to interview a selection of coaches IMO.

They always slid down the table at some point under him, even before he said he was leaving.

And they didn't win anything when he was coach. They managed to get to one final in his first year. He was there four years if memory serves.

Paul Anderson finally got them to win something, the season after Brown left.

Brown's previous team didn't win anything under him either.

He isn't a winning coach.

If you look where hudds was when he took over and where they are now, I honestly believe he had a Massive part in that as did maguire at Wigan which wane benefited off.

Maguire won things with Wigan.

It's possible that Brown is a very likeable chap who works well with players on an individual basis, although today that wasn't remotely in evidence. However, that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about turning a group of individuals into a winning team. Huddersfield won something AFTER Brown had left. I don't know about his Australian team coz I can't even remember which team it was he coached now but I remember they didn't win anything while he was coach.

We won't win a thing with him here and unfortunately we are going to see a lot more shellackings while he is here too because a winning team begins with a winning mentality, and we don't have that.

Not many coaches do win things with only two cups on offer and the hub cap. Just like Royce, potter and rush before him.

We have played a better brand of rugby this year which has made games more enjoyable than the last 4 years of boredom.

Has Brown improved us, then I'd say yes he has, we are winning more games than we have on the past. I also think some saints fans get really carried away with our squad when in reality it's not so great, it's full of weakness and players that are not good enough.

I don't think we can win anything with this squad even if we had the best coach in the world. Potter, Royce, rush and now Brown have failed (if he don't win anything) so maybe just maybe the players are just not good enough.

I could list the players that IMO isn't good enough and honestly it would leave us not being able to field 7 a side team.

We can have some of the best coaches and players at the club but the conclusion will be the same unless we look deeper towards the structure and culture at the club.
It,s something McManus has struggled with since leaving Knowsley Road albeit with the occaisional historical quotes in the match program to remind the club where they should be.
On the pitch we are very short of inspirational players to influence players with the right atitude, hence the retention of Wello and Wilkin.
Someone needs to step up in prominence to be a leader on the pitch, we,ve not had anybody for the last 3 years capable of doing this.

Until Good Friday I would agree with you, yes. We had been playing a better brand of rugby but then we have also had a 7 and a pacey backline, which has helped in that regard.


Are we? Last year ended up in 5th, the first time in years, and had spent a sizeable time in 9th. Under Brown we have been nilled for the first time since 2007 and we exited the cup at the first round since God knows when (having made it to the semi finals 12 consecutive years previously). We made it through to the next round this year thanks only to playing against 12 men and a dodgy penalty! So how are we winning more games exactly?


Our forwards are lazy (bar Wilkin and Robes) but there's nothing wrong with our backline or our halves. So we have the same problem we've had since James Graham left but Brown hasn't fixed it with his recruitment has he? We can't even get one of them on the field!


We are a totally different team now to when Potter was in charge, even to when Simmons was in charge. You can't compare because most of them are different players.


Most of this team are good enough. It's their attitude which isn't. And that attitude isn't helped by the tactics (tinkering, in the main) and attitude of the coach and possibly the club too.

People are born leaders IMO. We have a lot of passive players in our team, Roby included. I don't think we have a leader in there and maybe that says more about the people recruiting/promoting players than about the players. If you recruit/promote passive players then you have no leaders.

I consider Brown to be a similar coach to Eric Hughes for us ,we are a better squad under him than the previous 3 coaches despite some recent terrible performances .
But we don't have a killer instinct to go that bit extra and win a big game , maybe Brown , like Hughes, is not capable of coaching that.
I'd still be happy for Brown to see out his current deal then look to recruit a real ruthless coach .

When I was watching last night I was surprised at the amount of effort that some Saints players were putting into the game. Earlier in the season we were poop real poop, we didn't turn things around until mid May but prior to that time I didn't question the effort our team were putting in.

Last night was one of two things, just a plain old bad day at the office or a sign of more deeper problems within Saints.
You now have two really big games coming up in Cas at home & the Pies away, take two or more points from those games and you can say you are back on track and Perpignan was a horrible blip. It would not surprise me if you took the four points from the two games.

I still think that Saints will finish in the top three and along with Wire, Wigan & Leeds make up the four teams to contest the Grand Final eliminating games.

Thank god we've only got Cas and Wigan next...

I have never seen such poor tackling from a Saints side, shirt grabbing, Catalan just seemed to be able to walk past players.

I'm honestly a bit lost at the moment and the only phrase that comes to mind to describe it is Jekyll and Hide ( and no that is not a mis-spelling).

Lets start at the top, the big man is a huge Saints fan, I do not doubt he would do whatever is in the clubs best interests. However as a fan which we all are, we can make decisions that we think are in the best interest but we can be wrong.

The coaching staff and structure..

There must be an issue, I'm not going to profess great insight but others outside the club have commented on our ex-players conditioning and they are experts in their fields.

Signings which are down to the whole team, why do we have props who only like to play loose forward? 2nd rowers who only like to play loose forward? etc

The coach I do think he knows what he wants from the team, but I'm doubting that he has the force of will and motivation to get it across. I think he has the smarts but you can see people in any company who are very clever, but have no idea of how to manage people and get the best from them.

The players, these are the hiders. I've honestly no idea who is our best line up. At the start of the season it seemed very straight forwards, but now I'm not sure. Why because the player with the name on the back can have a great game one week and be awful the next.

We can't blame yesterday on Lance (I have had no time for him the last 2 years, but that's down to him not being a 6 he certainly puts in effort)
Laffranchi, Wilkin (all three missing from injury)

If I thought there was something magical like sacking them all then fine I'd suggest it, but I'm not sure playing the kids will change much it's seems to be catching.

Next week we could be fine, but a lot seems to be down to how the other side turns up.

I think the whole structure and culture at the club is very fragmented and this should be fixed first, otherwise any present and future coach will struggle at first base.
I.m very critical of our players conditioning to run the course of the season and the mental toughness impregnated into the players.

In a way I have a bit of sympathy for McManus who has had to battle on all fronts, a new stadium, turning the club into a profit making one whilst balancing youth development with overseas signings. All this means we have been in a long term transition period instead of a short one.

We really need a highly disciplined performance related structure in place to operate as one entity instead of the "cherry picking" of individual players who have and have not performed in a match.

The biggest problem we have and which can be fixed quite easily is our attitude and intensity of starting a game, I,ve only seen 2 games where we have got this right against Leeds and Huddersfield.

Hopefully monday morning is a positive productive one as for the next 2 games there is nowhere to hide for both player and coach.

Apart from Lomax . IMO put in a shift for Saints last night . Tackles well above his Wieght . Class player hope the injury is not too serious .

Regards , EW

The last trophy saints won was in 2008. That's 6 years ago. Quite a long time.

Completely agree, what a freak accident, just to turn in his run as Johnny did and go down like that! Noticed one forward who likes to go out to the wing area, and still struggles to get back in the line???

Could be very very tricky against Cas on Sunday. If they come out fired like against Wigan in the cup, it'll be a long afternoon.

Clearly it can't be fixed quite easily then! (But I'd add Warrington at the HJ too as we were great on that night)

If what I have heard is true, we will need a new fullback for the rest of the season.

That would be the icing on the cake of our season. Injuries yet again causing problems. Just stick Wello back in there. It keeps him quiet.

We've got one in Wello