I think a lot of questions on how the club is fixed financially will be answered at the end of the season weather we are in SL or not . We will have an indication on how the club invests in recruitment

This is Leeds we are taking about - half the posters on here think he should tell the club when he wants to retire.

I just don't see Leeds saying no - they seldom let players go early, how many extension did Kylie get.

I'm not disagreeing Sal, but its exactly this that has got us into this position.

I agree - that plus promoting juniors who are simply not good enough e.g. Sutcliffe, Handley, Briscoe, Keinhorst and poor recruiting e.g. Ormonroyd, Aston etc.

all cheap though

GH wants to hold the value of the cap as it is (restricts spend on higher quality).
GH doesn't want a reserve comp (restricts spend on youth by denying them longer to prove themselves)
GH doesn't want to change the 8's format (as it restricts the money given to teams outside SL)

Can anyone spot a trend here?

I know I'm playing devil's advocate, but the lack of willingness to invest in the playing squad given our available resources (turnover, profit and potential player pool) is pretty poor form...

GH would reduce the cap if he could.

The reserve grade me is not essential - Leeds produce more than sufficient youngster to feed the championship - having a reserve grade just prolongs the agony.

Surely moving away from the middle 8's gives more cash to the SL clubs so he would surely benefit from a move to a new format.

While GH is always the spokesman, I think it’s really Paul Caddick who is the voice behind it. He’s using the club as a cash cow and wants to limit costs while maximising profit, even if it’s at the expense of the growth of the sport.

You think wrong.

the thing doing the rounds that GH is thinking of bowing out in 12 18 months or so . If this has any substance ,what about Mr Caddick and his future at the club?

the thing doing the rounds that GH is thinking of bowing out in 12 18 months or so . If this has any substance ,what about Mr Caddick and his future at the club?

Caddick wanted out two years ago. Had a buyer who would have taken the club further forward. Hetherington put the block on it, and agreed a deal to buy out Caddick over a period of time, and this included the new stands agreements. I posted this early last year, when told at the time. Caddick does not have active involvement in the rugby side since.

I was also told he wanted to sell. came from the main sponsor of another club. no idea who to mind

I’d imagine there would be quite a lot of interest in taking ownership of Leeds Rhinos

you would think so

Whilst we're duffers on the field, we're one of very few SL teams capable of running at a (small) profit. The maths of that could change considerably though if we continue to go cheap and end up losing fans and sponsors as a result.

Sal - disagree about reserve grade. the gap between Academy and first grade is enormous, and the sport needs a proper pathway for kids to get into the first team. The idea of dual reg could have worked but only if the lower league teams had accepted their lot as feeder teams for SL. They didn't (fair enough) so we're now in a world where we have to choose a couple of kids at 18/19 to contract out whilst the rest are unceremoniously dumped and left to their own devices whilst DR is doing nothing for the credibility of the Championship.

The thing is the sport has changed a lot, and very very few players are physically ready for first grade at 18 or 19 now. Without bringing back reserve teams the only thing I can think of that could help is moving the age groups up a year at least, to U2s or even U21 (with lower groups bumped up as well to U17s).

Where do we get the other 20 odd players per club to run and pay for a reserve grade?
Just scrap the u19s, and make it the reserve grade. That way, it gives players longer to develop, but it would be far cheaper than running another competition.

Agreed - with the current system in place how many players have Leeds failed to develop into first team players that they could have if they had a reserve grade?

I don't buy into Brisbane's the kids aren't physically ready at 18 - this is SL not the NRL - Walker doesn't struggle with the physicality of the game neither does Oldeski.

The issue is more about what happens to players in the Leeds system and why so few actually reach the required standard - this is game-wide issue not just at Leeds. When was the last time Leeds produced a half back of any quality or a second row forward or a centre or a hooker - key positions in the team.

It's not a game wide issue as in all teams. Wane and Powell have made others look ridiculous. Just like Smith and McClennan did at Leeds before McDermott got in. Super League is packed with poor coaches and those coaches do not have it in them to develop young players, as a result the game suffers with a shortage of stars. The clubs who get the best youngsters around, have serious issues in their coaching if they can not have a constant conveyor of true talent developing.

Thats a very one eyed view. Kids are getting thrown on the proverbial scrap heap at 19 due to nowhere else to go. Without being rude clubs like yours signing all dry and sundry on too doesn't help when you have surplus players to just release. That isn't a slur on the process just a reality. Kids develop at all ages, one massive example of this was one of your greatest players jamie Peacock. James Roby another, never stood out on academy rugby, never a junior international, develops into one of the best hookers SL has ever seen as he had time. Peacock was a Late bloomer and there is a big chance he wouldn't have made it in this day and age.

It shows a lack of respect to championship clubs in my eyes that you can just 'fill the championship', look at where Fev have been last week or so without some of your players they have relied on all season. Like I say not here to argue just an observation of the game not just Leeds. We need a reserve grade in my opinion. Also sorry if it comes across argumentative/trolling certainly isn't meant that way, just healthy debate

Would players get better playing reserve grade or in Championship on dual reg? Surely that's the only thing that matters.

Not sure how reserve grade would help Leeds in truth really.

Consistent coaching, access to facilities, monitoring of performance.

Have Leeds seen an increase in number and quality of players coming through since they adopted dual reg?

I don't think you do have to find 20 odd more players to fill out the reserve grade team. A mix of players who are from the 19's pushing for a first team slot (smith, oledzki, newman, trout, oldroyd,sutcliffe) with a mix of players who might be coming back from injuries or cant get a spot in the first team at the minute/ the players loaned out (lilley, ormanroyd, walters, keinhorst). Although yes some recruitment could be needed for reserve grade we have the majority of a squad.

Wane is fortunate in that Wigan have by far the finest pipeline of talent in SL. He has had to use the youngsters but it really helps if you have the cream of the crop to start with. Leeds used to be in that position until Barrie McDermott and Brian McDermott were involved. Powell is in a similar position in the Cas. is a hotbed for junior rugby - Lock Lane, Panthers, Kippax etc.