I could see the temptation if we didn't already have an international FB.

Didn't you express concern over his concentration? Daydreaming FBs are generally poor ones.

TBF both Watkins and Sarginson are young players with a lot to learn. Both should have long test careers ahead of them provided they continue to develop.

I doubt Watkins has ever come up against anyone as good as Jennings before and that should be an incentive for him to improve.
I was surprised by Sarginson, he’s improved a lot since he left London where his defence was a problem.

I don’t think either should be too heavily criticised or written off. Once they get more experienced the defensive technique and positioning should improve. Likewise with attacking skills. If I were either I’d be looking to do a stint with an NRL club at some stage so that I didn’t flatline in development by coming up against lesser quality SL sides every week.

Move Watkins to FB? Jesus wept. You use stats to back up your argument, but then say Sarginson was the better of the 2 centres in the 2 games he played, but Watkins was the better centre in the 2nd game according to the stats.

Frankly, the continued use of stats to prove a players ability has become very tiresome. I'd be very surprised if any SL coach used player stats as a KPI. Perhaps they find them useful for missed tackles, but I doubt they have much influence on a coaches opinion.

He kept Inglis very quiet at Wembley last year.

I guess what I’m trying to say is that he doesn’t come up against the very best quality opposition very often unless he’s in the test team and playing Australia and so he'll be required to raise his game above "normal".

That student digs door must have been a soft touch !

Calm down. I only said I would be tempted to move him to FB - the position occupied by many of the games best attackers. I also qualified this suggestion which was made to overcome the apparent problem many have with Watkins not getting enough of the ball, or not getting enough space, or having none to offload etc etc.

The stats I used were for the SL to correct the point being alleged that he was the second best centre for try assists. Please quote the stats that prove Watkins the better centre in the 2nd game?

I see Garry Schofield has been in the press again, pointing out where Steve McNamara went wrong.

You remember Garry Schofield, right? And the stellar coaching career he had at Huddersfield, where his own players went to the board pleading to get rid of him.

According to Schoey, we're "no closer to Australia or New Zealand than we were before." I'm guessing he must have been up all night before the games indulging in his favourite hobby.

I seem to remember Watkins' one on one defence been pretty woeful.....maybe I am old fashioned but that is why I like Hardaker so much at FB. His one on one defence is the best I have seen for a long time and IMO that is just as good to watch as attacking prowess. As others have already stated he aint exactly a slouch in attack either.

No...for me Hardaker deserves the chance to grow more into the role at FB and Watkins to be coached more into the RC position. He still has those damn fine skills as evidenced by his near brilliant (damn that touchline) skill in putting Charnley clear towards the end of the Dunedin match.
If any of the centres should be moved it should be Moon ...into the SO position. That then however begs the question as to who would fill the LC role? Handley?

Moon was tried at half back at Brisbane and it was a disaster - every move we had would have to run diagonally towards the touchline!!

Watkins is a class player - It would appear he suffers because the coaching he is receiving at his club is hindering his development. If he were at Warrington I bet he would be a better player than he is now.

For what it is worth I enjoyed the test matches and I thought England provided credible performances and it does show a team that is improving.

You mean in the way that Tony Smith has improved Ryan "still can't pass" Atkins?

Maybe we could employ a noted rent-a-gob who used (before he was a rent-a-gob) to be the best British centre I've ever seen play for Leeds, to work as backs coach. He doesn't have a great record as a head coach, but maybe concentrating on a more limited brief, based on what he was world class at himself...

D'you think GH would go for it?

Depends if the Town Hall Tavern will do a deal for parties.

I know what you mean. The angles, movement and dummy runners the Kiwis and Aussies use out wide are a level above anything Watkins would face in SL, where only Wigan seem to really come close. You can't pair off one centre against another, they hardly ever mark each other as they tend to attack and defend in slightly different channels. It's the movement and option in front of defenders that cause them problems. In that respect a lot of the England players have much to learn.

Have you been in there recently? Not Garry's type of place at all nowadays

Its a bit like Kevin Sinfield's short kicking game - you can be the greatest coach in the world but if the player simply doesn't possess the skill set there is very little you can do.

Under Smith Atkins is a much improved defender/reader of plays and that part of game is where I would expect improvement under a good coach

If players don't improve as they get older/more experienced there really is a problem. But Atkin's alleged improvement may also be due to having better players around him than he had at Wakefield. He's a player who seems to me (on admittedly limited viewing) to blow hot & cold.
On balance I'd have Watkins every time over Atkins.

Would you say Kevin Sinfield's short kicking game is better now than it was ten years ago? Is Danny McGuire a better organiser than he was ten years ago.

I agree I wouldn't swop Watkins for Atkins either

Yes, I do think that Sinfield's short kicking game is better now than it was then & McGuire is definitely a better organiser than he was then.
But others have caught up with them & both have lost their pace which in McGuire's case is critical. Sinfield was never renowned for his pace.
I think defences generally have improved & the standard across SL has levelled out, whether that is up or down is a moot point.

I have and it’s much changed since Garry’s heyday.

Maybe The Three Legs might be more up Garry’s alley?

The General Elliot, The Regent, and the Prince of Wales would be ideal for him so it's not the end of the world for him.

I thought he held court in the Myrtle and Parnaby?

What colour's Parnaby?
I thought you were talking about the Hunslet kit that he's taken to wearing.

What a great final.
Despite the Kiwis being on top for most of the game I couldn't help but think the Aussies would still conjure up a win.
What a pity we couldn't keep hold of Greg Eastwood & what would we give to have a forward like Taupou?