I accept what you're saying but here's my take on the situation.

Kallum Watkins was Leeds' 1st choice replacement outside back for this season. He fulfilled that role pretty well considering he had already seen action as cover for Webb at full back, then Delaney at centre and finally Donald on the wing. Regardless of the fitness, availability and form of the remaining outside backs Leeds have lost their 1st choice outside back cover.

Jones-Bishop would, I believe and I know not everyone agrees with me, be capable of fulfilling that role. Would Jones-Bishop be behind Bush, Coady and Clarkson if he wasn't out on loan? Jones-Bishop's development at the Harlequins was a sound plan before the season started but circumstances have changed.

Why are Leeds searching 'far and wide' (according to Hetherington) to bring in an outside back on loan (or permanent if you believe some that claim to be 'in the know' on here) when they already have such a prospect on the books. Jones-Bishop is no kid either he'll be twenty-two later this season.

Sounds like Leeds are doing the decent thing and letting us keep him

I would love to see Lee Smith back in a Rhinos shirt, but if it is just one man's ramblings spreading over the net, BJB should be back at Headingley as soon as his loan deal allows

I think you do a fine job of hiding your true feelings.

Your insight serves you well.

Ablett has said he could be back for the Bulls game a week on thursday

www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/ ... 071842.ece Edit to say, looke like he played tonight for their A team. www.wasps.co.uk/news/wasps31386.ink

www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/ ... 071842.ece Edit to say, looke like he played tonight for their A team. www.wasps.co.uk/news/wasps31386.ink

[size=50Except Ben Jones-Bishop obviously.[/size


What's Jonah Lomu up to these days?

Amateur Bodybuilding.

Maybe it wont be long before the Vainakolo to Leeds thread resurfaces???

Doubt it as he has just signed a new 2 year deal today

Lee played for Wasps reserves tonight.

Heard t'other day that Gary Hetherington forgot to tick that box.

My understanding is that any loan deal has a recall clause. Could be wrong though.

That's not true, it's got to be specific to the agreement. Monthly loans automatically have recall's in, which after the 1st month allow you to recall.

But this is a season long loan, and I questioned that one on this board before the start of the season. If Leeds put the clause in then it will be fine.

You are spot on and my suspicion is that BJB can't be recalled immediately but that we may have to give notice to Quins, after all, as you say, it is a season long loan and if was Quins I would want to notice if you were taking away a player I was hoping to have all season. If I am taking a player on a short term loan things are a little different, but longer term I need some security or time to replace the player.

I think this is why BJB has not been recalled because by the time he gets here he may not be required for long, if not at all.

Well yes, but do you know what, it would not surprise me if they did not actually know that clause was in the operational rules! I love constitutions and rules, but I am sad, but they RFL Operational Rules are huge and it would be easy to miss!

I agree with G1's alternative definition of the clause as well BUT any challenge would assume that a club has asked the RFL board to consider changing a player status under the rules and they have done so successfully and therefore some level of precedent has been set. If they have not changed anybody's status as yet or it is has only ever been used around loan players on loan with other RL clubs, then any argument may fall flat.

Maybe Leeds' primary concern on Jones-Bishop is simply his long term development. This could be an important season for him to establish himself as a SL standard full-back (with Leeds hoping to reap the benefits of that next year and beyond).

I've no doubt from a development viewpoint he's better off having a full year as first choice FB at quins than having a handful of games as "1st choice outside back utility man" at Leeds.

I just don't think BJB offers any utility value. It's not a difficult concept to get your head around. Some players are excellent in one position whilst others offer great utility value.

If Webb were out for the season I suspect BJB would be recalled immediately.

I'm sure if you asked nicely we could lend you Karl Pryce for a bit

Quote ="G1"I just don't think BJB offers any utility value. It's not a difficult concept to get your head around. Some players are excellent in one position whilst others offer great utility value. If Webb were out for the season I suspect BJB would be recalled immediately.'" I have no difficulty with the concept only in whether it applies in this case. ___________________ www.rleague.com/db/player/s/stos ... /index.php [iWildcats coach John Kear said: "When James joined the club =#FF0000(200icon_cool.gif it was quite clear that he had to have a passport that would remove him from the =#FF0000existing quota limitations. So far that has not happened and, if he doesn't succeed by the end of the month, we will have to release him. =#FF0000Our overseas quota positions are already filled by Darryl Millard, Ben Jeffries, Glenn Morrison, Shane Tronc and Sam Obst, so we do not have any more places available. There are no problems between the club and James as we both knew what was required for him to remain with the club. We would like to keep James but, if he can't get his passport, then the matter is out of our hands."[/i That is another article that infers that the overseas quota is limited to five in 2010, yet the SL website says six. Quote ="Inflatable_Armadillo"Well yes, but do you know what, it would not surprise me if they did not actually know that clause was in the operational rules! I love constitutions and rules, but I am sad, but they RFL Operational Rules are huge and it would be easy to miss!'" The Wakefield squad in 2010 still contains (in addition the the five named above) Michael Korkidas, Jason Demetriou and Tevita Leo-Latu. You would then have to assume some or all of those have been exempted under the current rules, so I think it's highly unlikely that Wakefield were not aware of the existence of the clause.

Quote ="G1"I just don't think BJB offers any utility value. It's not a difficult concept to get your head around. Some players are excellent in one position whilst others offer great utility value. If Webb were out for the season I suspect BJB would be recalled immediately.'" I have no difficulty with the concept only in whether it applies in this case. ___________________ www.rleague.com/db/player/s/stos ... /index.php [iWildcats coach John Kear said: "When James joined the club =#FF0000(200icon_cool.gif it was quite clear that he had to have a passport that would remove him from the =#FF0000existing quota limitations. So far that has not happened and, if he doesn't succeed by the end of the month, we will have to release him. =#FF0000Our overseas quota positions are already filled by Darryl Millard, Ben Jeffries, Glenn Morrison, Shane Tronc and Sam Obst, so we do not have any more places available. There are no problems between the club and James as we both knew what was required for him to remain with the club. We would like to keep James but, if he can't get his passport, then the matter is out of our hands."[/i That is another article that infers that the overseas quota is limited to five in 2010, yet the SL website says six. Quote ="Inflatable_Armadillo"Well yes, but do you know what, it would not surprise me if they did not actually know that clause was in the operational rules! I love constitutions and rules, but I am sad, but they RFL Operational Rules are huge and it would be easy to miss!'" The Wakefield squad in 2010 still contains (in addition the the five named above) Michael Korkidas, Jason Demetriou and Tevita Leo-Latu. You would then have to assume some or all of those have been exempted under the current rules, so I think it's highly unlikely that Wakefield were not aware of the existence of the clause.

The Bradford version of Pryce could be very handy, but at the moment I'd rather have Chris Feather on the wing as he'd show a bit more heart

KAPOW!!!

Ok, I think it has to be 6 non-federation trained players maximum in 2010 as the operational rules are clear about this, and they must be king, and if Wakey have got it wrong, they need better lawyers. They are silent about it reducing to 5 for 2011 (but were clear about 2008, 2009 and 2010 and the reductions by one non-fed player each year), so at the moment unless that has been passed by the clubs and board already, I think we must take it with a pinch of salt.

Also, until this year there was not much difference between a 'Club Trained Player' and a 'Federation Trained Player' however, from this year you must have been with the club for three full seasons before you are 21 to be classed as a 'Club Trained Player'. Of course as there is currently no restrictions on number of club or federation players, just non-federation players and a minimum number of academy trained players, so unless there is going to be future restrictions, then it makes no real difference at the moment which you are, as long as you are one or the other.

We need to be careful here with Stosic as this may be about the the right to work in the UK and not the so called 'quota'. The operational rules are again quite clear about only being able to be registered with the RFL with the required permission to stay/work in the UK. I think that, given the rules are not that easy to follow maybe John Kear is talking about immigration issues and not registration issues but, as we all know Journo's can sometimes be lazy, and they may not be fully understand the issue themselves?

([ia) ‘Club Trained Player’: a player who has been on the Club’s register for any 3 full
Seasons before the end of the Season in which he ceases to be eligible by age
for Academy rugby league. For the 2008 Season only this shall be amended to 1
full Season and for the 2009 Season only this shall be amended to 2 full
Seasons. For the avoidance of doubt, where a player satisfies the definition in
each of the 2008 and 2009 Seasons and is on the Club’s register in both of those
seasons, the Player shall retain the status of ‘Club Trained Player’ in 2010 for so
long as he remains on the register of that Club but shall lose such status (unless
he satisfies the full definition of 3 years) upon being removed from the club’s
register and shall not regain it simply by returning to the Club’s register.
Otherwise, and again for the avoidance of doubt, from the 2010 Season onwards
a player must satisfy the requirement to have been on the Club’s register for 3
full Seasons before his 21st birthday in order to qualify as a ‘Club Trained Player’
and the fact that he may have qualified as a ‘Club Trained Player’ in the 2008
and/or 2009 Seasons shall be irrelevant.

(b) ‘Federation Trained Player’: a player who, for any 3 full Seasons before the end
of the Season in which he ceases to be eligible by age for Academy rugby
league has been on one of the Club’s register or the register of another Club
being a member of the same rugby league federation. For the avoidance of doubt
if a player moves from one club’s register to another club’s register and there is a
period of no more than 28 days in the Season (as defined) and any amount of
the period between the 1 December and the day of the first League Match,
Representative Match or Cup Tie (whichever is sooner) between being removed
from one register and being registered with another club, consecutivity shall not
be broken for the purposes of this clause.
[/i

[iSeason 2010: a maximum of 6 players who satisfy none of the definitions of Club
Trained Players, Federation Trained Players from the Club’s own federation or
Academy Junior and a minimum of 7 Club Trained Players or Academy Juniors[/i

Sorry tvoc, I got that wrong, it does now give a minimum of 7 'Club Trained' or Academy juniors, with Academy juniors being classed as any player under 21 at the club listed in the first team squad (or playing in the academy anyway, obviously). Of course to then become a 'Club Trained Player' when they reach 21, they must have been playing at the club for three full seasons prior to their birthday. So if you sign a 20 year old they would not have been at the club long-enough, once they got to 21, to be classed as 'Club Trained'.

Everyone clear so far???