Good, like your answer, I will take it that you have no idea what the hell you are on about.

I just feel we have a major crisis of confidence - it will soon pass and normal service will be resumed. Good players, don't become bad players over 8/9 games and i think that Brian Mc is right when he says that good can come out of a slump.

Huddersfield could quite easily get a hammering this weekend (although it might take a bit longer).

I do however feel that we need a quality centre (a bit like when we signed Ellis). I really think that Shenton of Cas is worth a punt. Not the finished article but could be very special with better players around him. Cash plus Ashley Gibson would be my opening gambit.

You can take it sideways from a horny donkey if you want pal.

And I aren't talking Bartercard here...

Re Smith vs McClennan, from what I recall on these boards there was a tendency to lambast Smith at every opportunity despite him winning the Championship for the first time in 30 years. Bluey seems to have had an almost criticism free ride to date, and it all seems to be down to whether people (and the players) 'like' him. I suspect that few if any Man Utd players 'like' Ferguson much - he's a dour, grumpy Scottish git. I couldn't care less if the players burn effigies of the coach so long as it works. So far Bluey has done very well IMO.

Regarding the squad, it seems like we have been vaguely successful over the last 5 or so years with a side based largely around locals, with the odd signing here or there and new juniors coming through to at least compete for spots in the team. I'm not quite sure why signings would make much of a positive difference at this stage, as the only reason to sign anyone IMO is to strengthen a clearly weak position (where there are no likely junior prospects).

TBH if anything that's why I wasn't sure of Buderus - not the money but with a GB and 3-time GF winning hooker plus the highly rated McShane, I would have thought that other positions were more of an issue - particularly second row.

The only 'flaw' in this model is that it absolutely will not guarantee success year after year. Funily enough that's possibly true of every other team's 'strategy'....

Just to back David up here, with facts.

Are they doing their job? I think it could be argued that Poaching for instance is actually far far from doing his job.

I know there are people on here who do not attach too much to results from the academy, but that reserve set up appears to have gone really backwards since he took the job.

Or is it just coincidence?

And there in lies a problem.

This sort of remark, same as from Gareth, and whoever, is complete and utter b0ll0cks.

Smith never got critisized in his first year, why should he have done.

Bluey was given the same leeway, despite efforts of some to change the view.

Smith did not get the critisism until end of 2005, when coincidentally success did not happen, and appeared to be blown by elementary errors.

Now Bluey is getting some critisism. Which coincidentally is happening as results have started to slip and performances poor.

On both occassions both coaches deserved the critisism. We pay good money, and expect to see quality performed in front of us. If its not then we as paying customers reserve the right to complain. If people dont like the critisism then bog off and jog along to another board.

Or maybe those who cant take a few defeats should bog off and support another team?

He has suggested that Poching, Cummins and McDermott only have their jobs because GH is being loyal to guys who were loyal to him - I have a problem with that.
But the real problem with his argument is that he defeats it himself all in the same post. He claims British coaches lack the capability to prepare players physically, he then uses the fact that Australian and Kiwi (note the and "Kiwi" bit here) coaches have won SL more times than British coaches and that we have been shown to be physically weaker and less fit at international level than the Australians and Kiwis.
He used this argument to back up his suggestion that we hire an Australian junior coach in the backroom staff.

So lets pull this apart:

1. the Kiwi GF winning coach he uses to support his argument is Bluey and he's already at Leeds... doh!
2. If the likes of John Monie, Brian Smith, Daniel Anderson, Graham Murray etc. etc... etc... can't lift British players to the same fitness levels as our Australian counterparts - what use is a no-name Aussie in the backroom staff at the expense of guys who have two years running managed to peak the team excatly at the right moment to go out and crush physically St Helens?

Can anyone deny that conditioning (physical and mental) was absolutely spot on for two consecutive GF's? Did we not look (despite playing the extra game) far fitter mentally and physically?

Ignore Magic Wind's contribution, he didn't read anything and didn't understand what the grown up's were talking about.

Even though they are ones talking the sense?

Defeats is irrelevant. And yes, I accept that some are posting purely because of that.

But performances is more important, and ignoring that is just ridiculous.

Let's take your arguement on little - whenever an Aussie side has taken the WCC seriously and fielded a reasonable side they have beaten the SL comprehensively - anyone who watched this years WCC cannot deny the huge differentials in skill levels - Manley were in a different world to Leeds and they have struggled to win a game in their own league - doubt that Manley have many British coaches in their rosta.

Leeds is McClennan's first full time first grade job - he was not brought up in the NRL - yes he won the 2005 tri nations but with a squad that had been brought up - in the main - in the NRL and had the physicality and techniques ingrained in that league.

The coaching and conditioning techniques in the NRL are worlds apart from those in the UK - it is one of the major reasons we cannot compete at international level - as we move one step forward they move two - do you think Ellis would be a better and fitter player at Wests or if he had stayed at Leeds under the likes of Cummins or Poching?

Leeds conditioning in this league is OK mainly because of the numbers of poor sides physically as Manley showed they were unable to cope with a fit NRL side that is the difference - anyone who don't think that employing some training techniques used in the NRL would not benefit the players at Leeds is simply deluded. As is anyone who thinks Cummins and Poching can do a better job than Steven Kearney.

As has been said here standstill and you will get passed.

But was that defeat because Manly are so much better or because Leeds are so poor this season.

I can say what I want whether its relevent to the thread or not, I like to call it "freedom of speech", its gets me through even when I look like a complete lemon!!

Can you ever accept success?

Despite all that, you haven't adressed the point that there have been a plethera of top Australian and Kiwi coaches taking most of the top coaching job in Britain for many years now. None of these (in your opinion) seems to have been anywhere near capable of lifting the fitness and conditioning level of British players to the same level as the NRL - have they just not wanted to use all their magic secrets on us? We have even had Australinas in charge of the game at a national level. So why would a junior, no-name Aussie second string backroom staff coach be able to contribute more than the A list of coaches who have already graced British RL? Why (which is the thing I have the issue with) do you think that our team are in place only because they are GH's buddies? They have clearly demonstrated the ability to have the team in great shape when needed.

The Manly game - well, we played a side that was better than us. Unless you haven't noticed that's happened a few times this year so that's a non-argument. There are other discussions on how our squad has shaped up this year and the tactics we are using which are far more relevent.

My sig. seems to be appropriate here I think.

Let's take this one on it's own.

"Fitness doesn't win matches, skill wins matches".

Do you know who said that and what his club achieved? Manly is the connection and the clue here.

Thomas the Tank Engine?

They are talking sense in your opinion. I call it knee jerking.

Yes, Leeds appear to have gone backwards but up until 3 games ago we were top of the league and in with a shout of the CC. Granted, results havent been good since then but I dont think it's time to panic just yet.
We had a bad spell in 2005 and reached both finals, 2006 even I questioned smith and it was ultimately a disappointing end to the season, 2007 we had a bad spell and won the comp and we even had a bad spell last year.

Thats the bit where you are confusing different posters Danny.

I dont give a flying feck that we were top of the league and in with a shout of the CC. The fact remains that we having been playing pish poor, and been dominated in nearly all the games. Even against oppossition that at the start of the season we would have considered embarrasing to have thought it.

Where you are correct is that some posters are Knee jerking, and only posting because of the defeats.

That however, does not go away from the problem that we currently have. This dip in form IMO is nothing like the one we had last year. The way we are currently playing is worse than anything we have seen IMO since 2002.

To question the whys and nots of this, is talking sense. Ignoring it is not.

But again, I agree that those, that would sink back under a rock once we start winning again, regardless of performance, should stick to hiding.

Is it because we've been found out on attack and needing to find a new way of working and having trouble settling?

The defence the last few weeks has certainly fallen apart and this worries me to some extent. Still dont think we've become a poor team overnight.

I thought the performace on Friday was the worst performace I had witnessed since we lost at Widnes in 2003.

What made it worse was thay you could see that Bradford was poor too, and we still couldn't beat them.

I would have expected a reaction against Salford, but obviously not.

The attack is predictable I agree there, we seem to be playing with a really deep attacking line, and just giving it through hands, there are no dummy runners or options for the half backs.

I've seen better attacking rugby in under 14 games.

there is no attack.it's just one out rugby.
the pack has been dominated and therefore we have so much more defence to do.
if we can get the forwards on top surely that will give the halves and backs the space to attack in and give us less defending to do

Yep thats the way I see it too. The likes of Gibson, Hall and Donald have been slated on here a bit recently but as you say the forwards arent giving them the space to work in.