The reason we were beaten last night is Saints controlled and slowed the ruck better. 60% of the time their retreating defensive line never went back the full ten and they were back up in our face reducing our go forward. Buderus was a shadow of his usual self in attack because of the slower ruck and was not as effective going foward. Defensively he was very good. Its a coaching thing but to get better go foward we need to work on quicker play the balls but stand deeper in attack. We have little or now organisation at scrum half because Burrow is not an organising scrum half and rarely takes on the line and draws in the defensive line. Lomax outplayed him last night and Saints look like they have a good prospect to work with to replace Eastmond. To say he was playing behind a beaten pack last night is a little off the mark. I thought the pack played reasonably well last night but selection is an issue in my opinion. I dont see Lautititi has a starter and we should have Clarkson starting for the graft and bring on Lauititi as an impact player. With regards Watkins he makes some big hits in defence but has let some soft trys in this season. If Delaney had played on the right last night I feel he could have saved at least two of the Saints trys and he tightens up our defense. With regards Cross I think too many Leeds fans have been bagging him since he came and like most overseas players he will take time to settle in. Last night he had his best game for Leeds by far, he takes the ball up hard and tacles well and in two months time he will become a big favourite at headingley.

I Would go........................

Webb
Hardaker
Delaney
Watkins
Hall
Sinfield
Mc Shane
Burgess
Buderus
JJB
Clarkson
Hauraki
Amblett


Subs

Cross
Lauititi
Leulia
Burrow

Kirk could be rested for next week to freshen things up and Senior needs dropping. As for Smith he has offered little this year and needs to fight to get his place back. Good to see competion for places is comming back.

Lets face it. Senior aint gonna get dropped.

Sad but true. Although he may notnhave done much so far this season, I'd put Smith at right centre, Watkins left and Delaney second row. If we're to see Watkins develop into the player he has the potential to become, I think McDermott needs to move him to his proper left side position and give him a guaranteed run of 4/5 games there.

will be a good chance to see Amour live. I have heard acs that he played well for Wakefield this weekend just gone, Not seen any of the highlights yet though

You could count on one hand the number of times Burrow has outplayed his oppossite number over the last 18 months. By contrast he has been outplayed by his oppossite on many occassions.

The excuse of playing behind a beaten pack is not always usable, what were the other excuses?

Burrow has been superb and outplayed his opposite number in at least 50% of this season's games.

He remains one of the best 7s in the league and one of Leeds most vital players.

I know you rate him very highly Gareth, but personally I just don't see it. Burrow pre 2008 wholeheartedly agree with you. Burrow since, not for me.

I watched Brough on Friday night playing behind a beaten team, and he completely stood out. I saw a young inexperienced kid on Saturday night playing in an unfamiliar role completely outplay Burrow.

If he can get back to pre 2008 then great, I'll hold my hands up and say you were right all along. But not seen any of that for a long while.

I'd go along with that and move Senior into the pack and drop Kirke. This would also mean that Ali shpould only be played for impact off the bench.

I'm amazed at the Burrow bashing on here. He isn't quite the player he was a couple of years ago but he is still one of the most important players at Leeds imo. He is one of the few players this season who has the capability to make something happen out of nothing.

I think he plays v well with Mcguire so I prediction is we will see a different Rob Burrow when Mcguire is back fit and playing again.

What surprises me is the rate at which Burrow has (IMO) gone backwards over the last couple of years.

When he won man of the series against the Kiwis, he looked like he was maturing into an organiser with a decent passing and kicking game to complement his running threat.

Slowly but surely that seems to have drained away from him, and he's back to being the one trick pony he was in the early stages of his career.

I'm sure Sal will find a way to blame it all on Sinfield.

I do rate him highly Gotcha. I enjoy watching him play.

He was very good against the Bulls and Hull and whilst it sounds fairly obvious, when the team is clicking and going forward, he looks better. If he has options (in terms of other runners in set plays) and he attacks the line he's unstoppable. Like, for instance, his try against the Bulls. Too often sadly he has zero option when he receives the ball other than to attack the line himself, which he often does with aplomb.

I wouldn't swap him for Brough and there's few other 7s I would swap him for.

I suspect whether he gets back to past form will depend upon whether the team gets back to past form but a change of 7 is no answer to our ills in my view.

Feel sorry for Burrow.

Must be difficult when your current halfback partner is so demanding in terms of calling the shots.

I suppose that's to be expected given it was Hull V Wakefield game.

G1
Agree with everything you've said about Burrow, best 7 in the competition and I love to see him play, full of guts our Robby. He's never been a creator but excells in support and open play behind forwards who create openings, unfortunatley these last 2 seasons we haven't had that many breaking the line.

Burrow hasn't declined. His problem is he has never improved where as the defensive capabilities in the SL have. 4 or 5 years ago he looked good because, lets face it, how often did you get a flat line infront of you? He is quick on his feet and can jink around flat footed players but when it comes to a solid, flat defensive line in front him all he is, is a short guy with some speed. My problem with Burrow is, and yes even i'm getting fed up of repeating this now, that he is an awful passer of a ball and cant read whats in front of him. Now to me, they are 2 of the main abilities you need when you are a half back. He continually blows overlaps instead deciding to go himself and when he should go himself more often than not he decides to throw one of his sloooooooow loooooping balls to the 2nd rower/centre, who by the time he catches it has is getting hit himself.

Yes, he has made 2 breaks this year but come on, even Kirke has done a few things right this year. If Burrow had come through say Salfords system I reckon he would be looked on as what he is, an average player who's only real atribute is that he's short and fast.

One other thing to remember about Burrow he as always been at his best with the triangle of Danny and Kev and he has not had much of that luxury due to injuries of one or the other.

So what you are saying is he's full back?

You cant be the best 7 in the comp and not be a creator. Come on people, am I really the only one who see's this? Robinson's a better version of Burrow than Burrow and he cant even get in at 7 for Hudds!

Wrong, he has only ever been at his best when he has played mediocre teams who dont know how to hold a defensive pattern.

And also, you cant blame him looking poor on 2 other players not getting much game time! Thats pretty much backing my previous point up that others make him look better than he is.

Not overly sure on my opinion of Burrow, He can be exciting to watch but for me does not create or organise enough. Few years ago i thought too that he was improving in these areas but seems to have gone backwards.

How do you think Danny Brough would perform in this Leeds RL side?

I know this isnt directed at me but since in "on one" i'll throw in my 2p.

Leeds would be a much better team with more space being created on the outside due to better accuracy and speed of passing. Add to this Brough's far superior kicking game and there you have it. How anyone can honestly say Burrow is the best 7 in SL is boyond me. He's not even the best 7 at Leeds!

This Burrow bashing is ridiculous he did'nt have the greatest year last year but spent plenty of it on the sidelines and when fit was part of a team struggling for confidence and form.
Prior to that he's more than proved his worth to Leeds and that he can match any 7 in this Comp.
As for Robinson he's that good at 7 the Giants went out bought the over-rated Brough.
If you highlight Robbie as inconsistent then the same can be levelled at Mono-Brow who for all his alleged talents plays for the Giants and when avaialable not 1 of Wigan ,Leeds ,Wire or Saints tried to sign him.
Now don't get me wrong the Giants are on the up and very much a threat imo but how many times did he open up an injury hit Wigan on Friday night?
Robbie has been there done that more than once and to be again writing him off 6 games in when he's been far from our worst player is OTT and absolutely ridiculous.
Now of course we all have our own opinions on players. coaches and performances but lets not go OTT writing a player off as successful as Burrow off 6 games into a season playing behind a beaten pack in an injury hit team and lets look at the bigger picture when assessing his creating abillities how trys come from the back off his quick dummy half play ,his half breaks or the number of defenders he attracts with ball in hand and he's still one of the best tacklers at the club aswell.
Is he as good as he was 4/5 yrs ago? maybe maybe not but the comp has also improved and he's still a major threat in this comp and his shortcomings/mistakes can also be attributed to those around him.
Still the no1 7 at the club imo and behind a dominant pack he will rip teams apart ala Bulls ,Hull and Salford and he still caused ST's problems in the 2nd half.

I like Robbie as I think he is whole hearted and has offered Leeds outstanding service. However, I feel that we have missed a plan B type of player, Brough offers you this with some incisive passing and probing kicking which we have been on the wrong end of for a number of years. Danny Mc and Rob are too similar and not complimentary.
If forced to select between the two I would select Brough ahead of Rob and think this will be mirrored in the England selection.

Agree that he is the number 1 7 at the club but that is because he is probably the only 7. Yes i wanted to give mcshane a go there. Think it would be good to experiment and see if he can play there as if robbie gets injuried he might have to and IMO has a better kicking game than robbie.

Not writing him off but i have not been a fan for a few years now not just on the evidence of the past 6 games. Again just sticking with him because of past sucess is also not a grat way to go for me.

The thing i do like about Burrow is his heart, he does get stuck in especially in defence, I think if some of our past props had his heart a la feather etc they could have been great.

IMO it shouldnt even be a competition. Brough was scotland captin. I wish we were more like football in this respect. Brough pinned his colours to the scotland flag, realising he wont get to play the Aussies switches teams. Shouldnt be allowed to happen.