I'm suprised no-one has mentioned to whether the Dambusters March will be performed by the Kop at Elland Road.





Chew on that one for controversial.

I never said "someone" elses mum!

Thy wit. I think you'll find my humour ranker than thy wit.

Interesting thread.

As as already been said, films are not documentaries. Artistic licence is ALWAYS taken with events for the sake of drama. Therefore, there is little to get excited about due to the changing of the dogs' name.

Having said that, the film would have more merit for me if it portrayed Gibson accurately in line with Puig Auberts description as someone portrayed as heroic but obviously racist in a time when attitudes were very different to now.

One of the greatest depictions of idiotic racists in film was blazing saddles. If that was re-made would the term be removed and replaced to avoid causing offence? If so, it would ruin the film. That film used the term more than any other film I can recall (aside from Gangsta rap videos).

Film (and other media) often depict tasteless, appalling, violent or unpleasant acts, behaviour, terms or phrases. So it should.

The gassing of Jews is offensive and unpleasant but I don't think Schindler's List would have been quite the same if they decided to fluff it up and leave that part out.

OK, so that was integral and the dog's name may (or may not) be but so what. The term is obviously offensive. However, depicting a historical character from a different era accurately cannot be offensive to any right minded person either whether they're a brother from Little London or a honkey from the kind of honkey villages both Puig Aubert and Batley Rhino live in.

To clear something up: Gibson named his dog after a popular colour of polish "N-Brown". The colour apparently matched the colour of the dog as a pup. I would imagine given the year and and the social circles Gibson moved in, he didn`t give a thought to any type of racial slur when naming the Pooch.

PC society eh? Good Golly!!!

Lets face it, it might be fair to say I am prejudiced against Sean Long.
Therefore I wouldn`t call my new puppy which I dote on "Sean" or "Longy".

That's just a shaggy dog story!!

That much is understandable. However, we don't have to use such terminology now. So let's not and instead be institutionalisedly polite to one another.

Quite true.

Its difficult for anyone to comprehend now but racism as we know it was perfectly acceptable in all levels of society at the time that the film was set in, and indeed at the time that the film was made, its also true that niger-brown was a colour included in every school childs paintbox and the word itself and its derivatives was used regularly on prime time TV programmes, I don't believe that it was a deliberate and overtly racist intent to call his brown dog "niger" as it would have been a common name to use, that he would be termed racist using our current terms of reference is a given but he'd have to be somewhere to the right of Nick Griffin to use the name if he were alive today.

I agree. My understanding was the same - the dog was named after the name of a dark brown colour in common use on paints and coloured pencils. How that colour was originally named I do not know, indeed it may have been racist or it may not have been. But until recent years it was part of the language and not used as a racist slur.

But to insinuate that Gibson was a racist is way over the top. In the war ere what we now accept as racist terms were in common use but at the time ordinary people were not intentially racist just because they used the language of the day. PC wasn't invented then as we were fighting alongside "the frogs" against "the Krauts" and "Nips"

But please, please never forget that our country went to war against an evil enemy that was truly racist in a way that cannot be compared with use of nicknames because in those days thats all they were.

You've obviously not seen the Wayans brothers first film, "I'm gonna get you sucker". Which deals with racism on an level that would get any White director hue and cried and hng by the posse.

You're right.

I hope to go to my grave without seeing any film made by the Wayans brothers.

Indeed. And it has been pointed out the dog was named after a colour of shoe polish FFS!

We remember on the 11th November, all the millions of all creeds and colour, who sacrificed their lives in pursuit of the very ideals that allow some on here to spew their apologist PC views.

Although I suspect, neither of them would be seen at the Cenotaph paying their respects.

Nor would they be welcome.

Who do you speak for?

Look, the name of the dog is a racist term. It was a racist term back then and has been for some time however you and others may try and defend it.

[urlhttp://www.aaregistry.com/african_american_history/2420/Nigger_the_word_a_brief_history[/url

[urlhttp://www.economicexpert.com/a/Nigger:word.htm[/url



In an age where attitudes to racism were very different to now I can fully accept that our heros were likely racist in their veiws because that will have been prevelant. We should not judge them by today's standards but nor should we be blinkered to the obvious.

I like to think the reason my dad & uncles went to war was so ignorant racists couldn't decide where & when people can pay their respects.

I'd pass on the thinking bit, and perhaps get an adult to explain the very fashionable and easily banded about term "racist" to you?

Then take another, more enlightened look at what has been written, and depart rejoicing into this chilly afternoon.

Seems you usually do.

Hey, the Australians have accepted that the word is not a part of modern day parlance, you only need to put the above colour of shoe polish into a popular search engine to find the furore over the renaming of the stand at Toowoomba Oval, which the local Aborigines actually wanted to retain. it took a UN commitee to get it changed in the end.

What is the problem with accepting that regardless of social or demographic context it is not acceptable now?

Shushed.

We've got enough window lickers onsite without attracting out of towners!

I'm an out of towner but I still went on parade. Am I allowed to continue posting?

Why am I not surprised by your supercilious tone? No doubt you adopt the same attitude to anyone disagreeing with your ignorance. Even the millions who are offended by the term. Very enlightening.

Ah,..... youre the f***ker with the two left feet then!


Be aware, if your christian name is Tom, all sorts of people may get a tad upset......

Save your breath. This moron is another user name for Ramrod.

He can't properly understand the issue, let alone debate it.