We can argue till the cows come home about the players.
It doesn't really matter: while they're been asked to do exactly the same as last year's mob, you'd expect this year to be a carbon copy of last. Which is how it's shaping up.

Hmm they don’t look well coached do they..

We are miles off competing with the top teams based on this season so far and the last 2 weeks in particular. Yes we beat Catalan, but spent most of that game defending our line. Last week for 30 minutes we ran harder, moved up quicker and tackled harder than the opposition and looked the better team. Unfortunately that type of performance has been a rarity under Smith. That 30 minutes apart we have shown no improvement in our style of play from last season.
We may need 3/4 better players to compete with the best teams, but the players we have rarely play to the best of their ability as a team under Smith.

We were that slow around the ruck area Saints didn’t have to slow the play the ball down. We managed superbly to do that job for them. Another master class in coaching from Smith-the best returner of a ball in super league is Welsby. So let’s kick the ball to him, wonderful.

You’re not going to see a transformed style of play while the same coach is in charge. RS style can be very effective but errors cost us second half last week and whole game this week.

RS doesn’t coach players to drop the ball, pass it into touch or kick out on the full etc. Leeds sides have been prone to stupid errors like this for years now though.

I’m more bothered about selections/benches not working out, and the new players underperforming.

Yep, pretty spot on assessment that. The next 5 are huge. We need to see this side clicking and performing much better and with more intensity. If not serious serious questions need asking of Rohan. This season is his last chance saloon. He’s been backed as much as possible in the transfer market.

The last time we beat Saints at home was in 2017 and since Brian McDermott left in mid 2018 we have only won once away, last season’s late drop goal by Blake Austin.

We’ve been miles behind them for a long time and that is mainly due to Hetherington’s incompetence managing the football side.

Losing Walters to Wigan and having a pack riddled with plodders is the perfect example of the fact he is well, well past his sell by date . He needs putting out to grass

We need to get Rowley in whilst we can , he at least can improve players and has structures . Unfortunately Smith can do neither

He may not coach them to drop the ball, kick out on the full etc, but what does he coach them to do?
Lack of line speed, players receiving the ball stood still, no organisation in attack are all issues that he hasn't been able to address. It is not only new players underperforming, the team as a whole have been underperforming for the last season and a bit under Smith.

The No 7 for Wests putting in a good kicking performance this morning

On last night’s performance I’d agree with you.

Overall though I do think the side has progressed from last year. Frankly I just want to get out of this crappy weather and see what we look like further into the season.

Handley, Croft, Smith, Ackers, Martin, Newman, Mik, Sangare have been in decent form this year. Bentley has been better than last year. Miller has had lots of good moments.

Holroyd, McDonnell, Mom look undercooked.

We aren’t playing well enough as a team though and we have a couple of individuals struggling for form.

And O'Connor needs to be in the reserves next week. Two huge defensive errors in consecutive weeks. Nowhere near good enough from a player who's main strength is defence.

Against Cas I’d be tempted to consider McCormack for Mom, Sinfield for Frawley and Ruan or Goudemand for O’Connor.

I wouldn't be changing the spine unless we have injuries. They need game time together. We definitely need some extra pace and athleticism in the team, though.

Thanks had a listen really gushing stuff but to be honest I'm not that bothered how good he is at coaching more worried about his playing credentials looks like another can't be ar%!d journey man but still better than Frawley.

I don’t think RS will drop Frawley. Apart from anything else it would be an admission of failure on his part. Matt can play better to be fair and he’s decent in D too - I just think he’s been poor for 2 consecutive weeks.

I think with the quality in our team, we can play better than we are showing.

I’m sorry but I just don’t think Rohan is capable of getting the best out of our team. I will give him until 12 weeks but can’t see anything changing than win one week, lose the next.

For mine, we must win at least 8 of the first 12 for him to remain in the job and even then unless there is a vast improvement, I suspect I will likely remain unconvinced.

I wish we played with the intensity of the first 30 minutes last week, albeit that seems a rarity.

No doubt Leeds will put 50 past an awful Cas side and all will be forgiven. Then the following week there will be another awful performance.

I would not be surprised if O'Connor was dropped with young Sinfield on the bench next week. Frawley could spot Ackers at nine when he goes off with Jack at half.

Just ask the Midget fans if Frawley can play better

I actually thought Bentley played well last night despite a couple of needless penalties.
If the other forwards put in as much effort in tackling we would look so much better defensively at least.
Like I said last night poor team selection, not replacing Momorovski when he couldn`t walk and not having Ruan or Goudemand on the bench was a mistake.

Well it’s either make some changes or accept this is the best version of Leeds we can have this year until Fus comes back on the right wing.

We should comfortably beat Cas but it’s another potential banana skin. I’d pick a big side and go straight down the middle on them.

Also if Jason QareQare isn’t contracted up for next year, in the absence of Davies or Johnstone is he a potential target? Given that we have his brother at the club?

Quote from the BBC website:
“ Leeds head coach Rohan Smith:
"It's very disappointing. There are a lot of hurt people in that dressing room.
"You could feel that aspect of what we wanted to accomplish this year has slipped away. It's disappointing that our focus now is on one competition so we'll dust off and go again next week.
"In the end it's a couple of deflections and a shocking miss on a barge that cost us the game.
"There's plenty for us to take out of it as far as hanging in there and keeping connected, but I thought we were not where we needed to be and the better team clearly won."

Not sure what there is to take out of that game and if he thinks a couple of deflections and a missed barge are the reasons we lost then he has lost the plot.

Thing is if we’re pinned back in our own 20 constantly then a deflection can lead to a try. I would say almost every point Saints have scored against us for 2 games now has been direct result of penalties and mistakes. They’ve scored tries in the set after we gifted them soft possession maybe three times?

Don't think we'll put 50 on cas, in fact I think we might lose given our woeful strike rate.

And while I agree with your take on Smith I'm not convinced he'll stick around for another 12 games. I don't think he's the type that enjoys being told he's wrong - a message I suspect he'll be hearing rather often in weeks to come. I hope I'm wrong.

I dunno I’m a bit torn on Leeds under RS. I do think we’re making progress, but last night wasn’t good enough. I can take losing to Saints but not with slack play like that, at home, in a cup game and when they had a few missing.

Conditions have been poor and I think we will do better in the dry, but if you can’t play rubbish conditions then you’re not going to win the CC or GF.

Cas away is a good game to have next, and we have winnable games coming up so we need to show what we want to be about this year.