Agree with almost everything you've said above apart from the international competitiveness element. We were beating New Zealand home AND away circa 88-95 and quite convincingly. I wouldn't fancy our chances against them away from home right now, but as we no longer tour NZ (unless it's a one-off game as part of a 3N/4N) and prefer to play them in home series only, I guess it's currently unprovable.

I loved the Lions/Kangaroo's tours as much as the next bloke William. In fact, i reckon you would struggle to find a poster on here who watched the game pre SL who wouldn't want a return to that format of internationals and for it to be the pinnacle of RL. You don't have to preach to the converted, who is to blame for it's demise? don't ask me, but i can only go off of results and the reality of what we have today as an international scene.

Away from home against a full strength Kiwi outfit now I wouldn't fancy us either but we've come close in recent years. The last time we played them it would've been a draw but for us going for a try and the win.

Looking at the results 88-95 our away results versus the Kiwis were very close games indeed. The only convincing wins were at home and the only easy series was in 1993.

From a development point of view training and playing in the 'summer' months is much more preferable and conducive to skill development at junior and youth level. Training on a 20x20 divot ridden pitch under poor floodlighting when it's 2 degrees is quite the opposite of the conditions experienced in Australian amateur rugby. Playing standards are always much improved in better weather conditions at all levels of the game and I'm sure this will be seen as the SL season moves on.

Could you be more specific.

Which months are the playing standards much improved according to weather conditions?

Why haven't other footy codes latched on to this alleged summer development and increased playing standards bonanza?

Why is our game still crap and a zillion miles behind the Aussies?

Finally, when you mentioned 2 degrees, poor floodlights and divot ridden pitches, were you also humming along to the Hovis Bread theme tune at the same time?

You are just being awkward. His point is clear and accurate. Do you seriously expect an answer to the question about other codes?
And there are numerous reasons for the gap between NRL and SL but the obvious answers dont seem to sit well with you: cash and player pool.

Such a shame that you can't hold a conversation without all the daft comments as apparently some are of the opinion that you're more intelligent than you show.

As someome who's been involved in coaching and developing the game for 13 years I think I speak from a position of authority on the subject. The months where the evenings are lighter and the conditions are improved are far better for youth and junior rugby, playing standards always improve as the weather improves (I'm not sure that needs any further explanation)

Rugby as a ball handling sport is greatly affected by weather (more so than football), rugby union could well do with benefiting from summer playing months as the playing standards in this country are hardly a vote for playing in the winter. Both of those sports are also richer and provide better training facilities on the whole.

I remember attending a coaching clinic lead by Gary Freeman when NZ toured and he couldn't emphasise enough how he thought that the weather was a big difference in contributing to playing and development standards in the southern hemisphere.

The game is so far behind the NRL due to a number of very simple things that aren't difficult to grasp; the conditions which the game is developed in (as mentioned above), our countries national obsession with football in competing for athletes, the resources at all levels of the game, an NGB that needs a shake up and most importantly of all the sheer weight of numbers that play the game being more than double ours in the southern hemisphere, it would be embarrassing for the NRL given their resources if they werent the dominant force.

Now your mistake there is trying to talk rationally about something you know about, to some one who's only entertainment seems to be derived from getting a rise by Rhino Bashing specifically and UK RL bashing in general. Don't understand it myself and some on here, who know Big Bad Billy say he's knowledgeable and a nice chap to boot. If so he hides it well. Good post BTW

What an incredibly dishonest and propagandist post. The only month RL isn't being played and there's no training is December and even then, Leeds and a few other teams can't help themselves by staging a Boxing Day challenge.

Pre-season training and friendlies take place throughout January, the season for real kicks off first week in February. It starts in winter and the finals are played in winter. Hardly any games of significance are played during the summer months as the rounds become turgid and stale, and guess what? Attendances just happen to decrease during those same summer months as folk discover better things to do.

Quit placing the cart before the horse. At least Bullseye had the honesty and foresight earlier to admit the only reason the season is currently structured is down to Sky and the dosh they stump up for SL clubs who are utterly clueless when it comes to generating income.

Super League is nothing more than a sport living on handouts from Sky. They'll be back to a normal August to May season if and when Sky withdraws its financial support which could well be sooner rather than later. Do they need RL with all that T20 cricket they can now show instead?

If there was anything to be gained from switching to a summer season, Rugby Union would have made that switch before us. They didn't need to bend over in desperation and do exactly what they were told for a few bob in 1995 either.

What progress has the game made since 1995? Are we catching the Aussies up? The only players who seem to progress are the handful who are playing in the NRL therefore it certainly ain't anything to do with our summers or our summer coaching methods. And participation levels in this country are down significantly, hence the huge reduction in Sport England funding.

Feel free to retort with how RL used to be played in black and white, on muddy pitches in freezing arctic conditions when players were fat and speccies wore flat caps and thank the lord that Super League came along and made life so much better for all.

Your problem is that you have to justify SL and summer seasons because it justifies any input you may or may not have made in the sport. If you don't like winter and can't cope, put a friggin' jumper on, ya wuss.

You know absolutely bugger all about rugby league development and also failed to note that my post was predominantly about junior and youth development, and the points are absolutely valid. Junior rugby has only recently moved to the summer season and will take time for these benefits to be seen higher up the game. At a professional level football and union have always been found wanting so they could benefit though logistally maybe not possible.

I don't disagree that our dependency on Sky funding drove the decision, the points about the benefits to the junior game and a longer period playing in better conditions still stands. I'm very honest about our games failings which is partly why I've passionately devoted many years to the sport.

Anyway I'm done here William or whatever your name is, you're beneath me or anyone else for that matter while you assume the role of Internet troll and pantomime villain, anyone with a degree of intelligence can engage people regardless of differing opinions. You have never displayed any knowledge about the intricacies of the game beyond your generic rants and rose tinted views of the past.

What would be gained by switching back to winter then?



Why is this the British barometer to whether some people enjoy/not enjoy a sport......whether we are as good as another country where the sport is clearly a much bigger deal.

How on earth did the game produce players like Murphy and Millward back in the day?

If Jordan Lilley is the future, you know what you can do with your so called summer rugby and its junior development?

Actually, I'd settle for a Kevin Dick right now. At least he had some pace off the mark and could pass.

seeing as you don't rate sinfield, did you rate Kevin's old mate, John Holmes ?

I think that is pretty obvious - customers want value for money, you cannot continue to sell an inferior product for a higher price for ever as the saying goes "You can fool some of the people some of the time etc...."

The second best passer (in both accuracy and timing) I have ever seen.

Dishonest & propagandist you say?
What about the WINTER months of October (65% of it), November, December & January, during which no SL games are played? Which 3 & a half month period would you suggest for a summer sport to have its off-season?
If not dishonest, your views are certainly propagandist & disingenuous.



I see that you are not a great follower of the Challenge Cup then?
Or, indeed, the SL playoffs?



Are not the Premier League, with all their riches, at the behest of Sky (& now to a lesser extent BT). Can Chelsea say "No, we are not going to play on Sunday, we prefer Saturday fixtures"? 'Tis the way of the world & I know that is not to your taste, but no amount of hissy fits/foot stamping by you or anyone else will change it.



Again, disingenuous. You have continually failed to address the MAIN reasons for the imbalance in quality, ie that in Aus RL is the no.2 sport (behind Australian Rules), has a much larger participation base, & has a vastly greater TV deal. With the massively greater money available in Aus, is it a great surprise that the cream of English talent is head-hunted by the NRL? (though how Burgess (x3), Graham, Whitehead, Hodgson, Burgess, Cooper, Ellis, Morley, Eden(?) et al can have become so good during a summer era god-alone knows eh?)



Debating champion 2016 right there

Who was the best.

England football haven't won a tournament since 1966, & before that never

They don't seem to have a problem fooling all of the people all of the time

Wally Lewis IMO... the complete player who could do anything.

Given that I agree with you about John Holmes and that wally Lewis was a great player, you can't be my mother-in-law, I admit I'm a little disappointed.

Ooh, ooh I know this one. Does it involve you telling all and sundry to shove their dying sport up their s, followed by you leaving RLFans for good, again?

Hope so.

They're doing a good job on you. Don't you go to all home and away games?

You mug.

The PL is consistently trying to attract better players to improve the quality of its offering - the improved quality is reflected in attendances and world wide demand for their brand - would you not agree?

I am reaching a point where the opportunity cost of watching this standard is getting too high.

I didn't go to the CC final last year - the contest wasn't worth the time and cost.

Ah, but i said England football, not PL. Don't know the facts, but I would imagine that they are the richest international brand (Spain & Brazil could compete I guess), they sell out Wembley for even meaningless friendlies. Considering the dross that they have served up for 46 years (I consider the 1970 squad also to be internationally competitive & attractive), then they haven't done a bad job of fooling an awful lot of people for all of 46 years.

The PL is a more complicated beast, being the world's richest football league. They can & do attract some of the best talent from around the world, thus attracting Joe Public to see the latest Azerbaijani (et al) sensation. In monetary terms, I would imagine comparing EPL to, say, the French Ligue 1, is similar to comparing the NRL to SL. Of course there are far fewer players in the world pool to pick off in RL, so they get the cream of SL, New Zealand & more importantly the South Sea Islanders.

I guess it's chicken & egg situation. You cannot improve the standards & offering of SL without a much higher income. You cannot massively increase your income when the product only has a relatively small customer base.