Which of course doesn't seem to tally with Leeds' published accounts. Fifa recommend that to be stable a clubs wages should not exceed 70% of their turnover. In the PL most clubs exceed this significantly (hence Bates ambivalence towards promotion). As I mentioned above Leeds' wages to turnover is around 50% and reportedly the lowest in the championship.

Depends what we're talking about though - If its the general running of the club then the buck stops with Bates, if its the recruitment policy at a micro level then yeah who knows how much freedom Grayson has.

the wages may be 50% of the turnover but that doesn't mean players are not earning £10k a week.
the fact is i don't like or trust bates but grayson is totally inept. he has signed so much rubbnish in his time and the team play like strangers. it is a total shambles

Its a real shame what is happening at Elland Road.

For a long time the fans have suffered incompetence, either at board level during the Ridsdale era, or in the dugout now. Bates is clearly a leech on the club, only interested in extracting money, rather than further adding to a glorious history, by making sensible investments that would not add financial risk to the clubs accounts. Whilst he remains as owner, the situation will not change as he has no desire to invest in the club for the benefit of the club or fans, merely to furnish himself with a plaything that sustains his lifestyle.

The next to go will be Snodgrass as the vultures are now circling over the carcass of the club, and the current management will simply see more ££££ to be extracted. After that others will leave, and it will become more and more difficult to bring in players of any kind of quality as the negativity around the club will only increase.

Like I said, it's a shame, and one that won't end until Bates passes away, as there is no way he will sell the club.

Snodgrass terminated contract talks. Can't blame him.
The young, exciting midfield we based all our success over the last few years upon of Kilkenny, Johnson, Gradel, Howson, Snodgrass has now been completely torn apart.
Grayson has his faults but how can he be expected to improve us when this happens. I think he should walk away now, if not he'll be gone by the summer anyway.

it does not fill you with glee

always felt he would bleed the club dry

unfortunately mist clubs end up selling their best players to bigger clubs. its one of the reasons the championship is always so tight. any team who performs well, has their top players poached at the next transfer window. the only way to escape it is to either come from nowhere like QPR, norwich, blackpool etc, or its to become one of the rich boys and find a backer with enough patience to get you up.

this certainly isn't a problem isolated to Leeds.

Personally, I'm not a fan of bates, but I thinkost fans go OTT in their hatred of the man.

I was at the game today - first game I've been to in a while, and to be honest was absolutely disgusted with the majority of the Leeds fans! Ok, ok I get it - most Leeds fans hate Bates, but after a while the incessant chants started to get really boring and annoying! There were 11 players on the pitch who needed the crowd's support, but far too often the crowd were so immersed in their pointless Bates hatred that the action on the pitch became secondary. Yet, in the second half, when the crowd finally did come round to the idea of actually supporting their team, the way the team lifted and the response they gave was clear for any idiot to see.

It always beats the hell out of me why people pay good money to go to Headingley just to stand there and moan the entire time, surrounding themselves and all around them in abject negativity, and it was exactly the same at Elland Road today. Newsflash people, players respond to support - stand there and slag them all off and do you really expect anything to come of it?

As for Bates, what exactly is the point in all the protesting? He's going nowhere, and clearly doesn't care a bit what anyone thinks of him - never has, never will. The chanting will change nothing, and will do nothing other than ruin it for those who actually go purely to try and enjoy the game - for God's sake get behind your team, and save your stupid chants for outside of the game!

i think its a problem with sports fans in general. its exactly the same at Forest. There are some exceptions, but on the whole sport is a painful and frustrating experience, and people like to blame someone.

Leeds lifted when Ipswich went down to ten. Before that we were appalling. Again. The result papers over the cracks

if my memory serves me correctly, its the third game in a row we've played against 10 men, and have only really squeeked past. with 11 we would probably lost most of them.

without ipswich giving us all three goals we wouldn't have won this one

I still think we'd have been good for at least one goal if it had stayed 11 v 11 - the wind made a huge difference and Ipswich looked suspect at the back. Having said that, the red card, followed by the back pass straight to Snodgrass, then the subsitute keeper getting caught in no man's land for the 2nd goal, meant that in the space of about 10 minutes they well and truly gifted us the game.

I still question the mentality of the fans though - we have no more a right to win than any other team, and the team are clearly low on confidence at the moment - there have been better times earlier in the season, and there will be better times ahead. The Bates furore is a complete waste of time and will achieve nothing, so the fans may as well throw all their support behind the players - something I always thought "fans" were supposed to do ffs! Always have faith in your team - they might just surprise you - the 2011 Rhinos proved that beyond any doubt whatsoever.

On a psoitive note, a win is a win, no matter how it comes about, and can only improve confidence. We've taken 7 pointd from the last 9 in the league, and came away from Arsenal without taking the hammering many thought we would. Becchio took his goal well at the end which can only do good things for his confidence, and it was good to see Delph back - hopefully they can get him for the rest of the season.

There are always two ways of looking at things - negatively and positively. I will always go with the latter, and feel sorry for those who immerse themselves in negativity, life sure as hell can't be much fun for them!

We are crap, have been all season apart from the performances against Hull (h) and Forest (a).

We have gone backwards so much in the last 2 years since we beat the houses it's unbelievable and apart from Snodgrass, Becchio and White they're all Grayson's signings. Can you blame Howson wanting out ? You sit next to Beckford and he's replaced with Billy Paynter, you sit next to Kilkenny and he's replaced with Micheal Brown, you sit next to Kasper Schmeicheal and then he's replaced by Paul Rachubka.............Mika Vayrynen and Mikael Forsell then turn up and then Aidy White tells you the new contact he's been offered is on equates to less money per month than he's currently on...........

I'd like Bates out as much as the next man......but if he goes tomorrow will the team dramatically improve overnight ? I don't think so.

A current board member (admittedly a Bates boot-licker) laid the blame at the manager's door on more than 1 occasion on Saturday due to the "dross" he'd signed. But as a club director surely you should have influence on these matters and do something about it instead of trying to save face against a barrage of criticism and writing pointless newspaper articles ?

The club is f**ked from top to bottom.

Oh yes............the irony of a Liverpool supporter trying to have a laugh at our expense.

theres a fair amount of boll0cks in that post, however your points I agree with on the whole.

so you agree with most but a fair amount is bollox?

Yep, certain points are daft or completely wrong, such as


and



suggest to me a very short memory about where we have come from.

However, the general gist that although Bates is not exactly demanding a return to the premiership, he's not the sole reason for our problems is one I agree with.

I spend a bit of time at thorp arch, have done for years, and it's not a happy camp. Grayson has upset a lot of players and most would be happy to see him gone

And certain players are on £15k a week. This comes from a first team player. Becchio, snodgrass and mccormack are three. Also, and i don't know which idiot agreed it, but paynter and brown are also on this. Leeds wage bill is £11m a year. More than enough at this level

Tad, if your figures are correct, I'm flabbergasted. In my opinion, every one of those players would be well over paid at £250K a year. In fact, £250.00 a week would be more like it!

Peter lorimer announced the figures pre match. Someone said they were also in the programme.

The figure includes all coaching staff too don't forget, also the medical side.

Great win on Saturday.

Please elaborate on why those 2 snippets are daft & completely wrong.

So 2 years ago, we were top of the League One, but were having a dip in form post Christmas. However, we were a team playing in a low league, and being by far the biggest team with most assets available to it.

Currently we are a mid-table/playoff team in a league where a third of teams have recent (last 3 or 4 seasons) premier league expeience. We don't have a vast amount more resources than anyone else.

It may not be as much progress as people would have liked, but its certainly not going backwards


On the second point I would agree that there is stuff wrong at the club, there is at most clubs, but considering that between 2002-2007 there the club in free fall, suffered multiple relegations, any player that was able to be sold, going for bargain basement prices to anyone interested, multiple chairmen, multiple managers, dressing room problems, cliques, over the hill journeymen, financial irregularities, points deductions, massive debts and massive losses I don't think you can compare the situation at the club at the moment to being f***ed from top to bottom, considering where we have been within recent history.

On a glance at the league table, I make it 18 out of 24 clubs in the Championship that have been in the Premier League since it formed.

I also reckon 12 of those have been in the PL more recently than Leeds, including 7 of the 8 currently above Leeds in the table. Cardiff being the exception in the top 8. I might be wrong, but I don't think I am. Plus Leicester who I think went down the same year as Leeds?