Senior is still one of the two best centres at the club given the current injuries to Delaney, Smith and Jones-Bishop.



I don't watch the lower grades so have no idea what if any options are open to the club beneath the current 1st grade squad. Could any replace Senior?

By dropping Senior are you suggesting a centre pairing of Clarkson and Ablett given the other injuries. Won't that leave the forward panel in a bit of strife?

Menzie Yere? Further increasing Leeds' reliance on 'overseas trained' to eight. Another straight off the production line.



It won't happen no matter how much you may wish it. Senior has played every minute of the Leeds campaign so far hasn't he?

So what ?

I know you like your stats so I'll give you some - 1 try in all those 720 minutes.
Just 2 initial breaks (according to Opta who I also know you're fond of) and 0 supported breaks.

He has played 384 of the 410 weekly rounds in SL for Sheffield and Leeds and the guy has shown amazing durability for fifteen years and more.

It gives me no pleasure to call for his axeing but he is simply not contributing. A sad case of a good player going on a year too long and a coach selecting his team on past reputation, not form.

How will we know whether there is anyone in the reserve team worthy of a chance if we don't give them one when a man is SO badly out of form ?

The first part of this statement may be true but the second is unfair on the coach. Senior hasn't been good this season and I am as disappointed with his performances as anyone but tvoc is right - at present Senior should play because there isn't a better alternative at present. Delaney should play on Friday but I expect Watkins will be needed on the wing with no Jones-Bishop, Hardaker and, presumably, Smith. Picking Senior up to now and again on Friday is the coach picking the best options available.

From this and other threads the general consensus (including my own) on Senior seems to be that he has been a fantastic player and one of the best centres that we’re likely to have in blue & amber (past tense) but he’s one season past his best and time his boots stayed in the boot bag.

A player that is consistently available is a valuable resource to a coach struggling to select from a depleted back division.



I'm also fond of the left winger scoring tries (7), some directly from the centre's contribution.

Senior - On average per match: (Rounded)
84 metres, 14 hit-ups, (6.17 mt)
19 Tackles, 1 missed tackle, (94% effective)

0 Supported Break - What's this?



As I said previously, I don't watch the lower grades and therefore have no idea who is pushing Senior out of the way.

You've gone further elsewhere saying there's no-one coming through.

If Senior is to be replaced then by who? Coady?

IF Smithy is fit i'd seriously look at geting Watkins on the left with Hall and having either Ablett/Delaney or even young Aston Wilson who's doing well in the u20's there with Smithy on the wing and with everyone fit my back line would be...
Webb ,Hall ,Watkins ,Smith ,Bjb. You could even swop Bjb and Smithy around or bring in Hardaker on the wing with Bjb likely to be out much longer.

i wonder if senior will get owned yet again tonight?

Entirely agree.... You could have all six playing by having one of Smith, BJB or Hardaker playing FB and Wilson on the bench.

Senior into the second row for me alongside Delaney.

Webb at halfback with McGuire..... Burrow to subs bench if Wilson not fit...or to Subway to buy the sandwiches

And the rest. I'd have had Seniors peak around 2002, then another high point around 2004-05

The problems with Senior and perhaps why he is so durable are
His inability to follow any defensive pattern which suggests he makes fewer tackles than he should
He defends on the left most teams attack on the right[/list

Putting him in the second row would be a disaster IMO he would leave holes up the middle on a regular basis

Quote ="Sal Paradise"Putting him in the second row would be a disaster IMO he would leave holes up the middle on a regular basis'" Like this you mean: Senior: 86 - 14 (6.14) - 35 - 0 (100%) - 0 - 0 viewtopic.php?f=17&t=469793 As that is the only occasion Senior has been asked to start in the second row I'm not altogether sure what you are basing your opinion on.

Quote ="Sal Paradise"Putting him in the second row would be a disaster IMO he would leave holes up the middle on a regular basis'" Like this you mean: Senior: 86 - 14 (6.14) - 35 - 0 (100%) - 0 - 0 viewtopic.php?f=17&t=469793 As that is the only occasion Senior has been asked to start in the second row I'm not altogether sure what you are basing your opinion on.

Quote ="tvoc"Like this you mean: Senior: 86 - 14 (6.14) - 35 - 0 (100%) - 0 - 0 viewtopic.php?f=17&t=469793 As that is the only occasion Senior has been asked to start in the second row I'm not altogether sure what you are basing your opinion on.'" Maybe he's able to come to a conclusion without the need for stats. Stats should be used to emphasise a view point not to create a view point. Seniors reading of the game and pace etc is probably the reason for the hesitance in playing Keith in the second row.

Quote ="tvoc"Like this you mean: Senior: 86 - 14 (6.14) - 35 - 0 (100%) - 0 - 0 viewtopic.php?f=17&t=469793 As that is the only occasion Senior has been asked to start in the second row I'm not altogether sure what you are basing your opinion on.'" Maybe he's able to come to a conclusion without the need for stats. Stats should be used to emphasise a view point not to create a view point. Seniors reading of the game and pace etc is probably the reason for the hesitance in playing Keith in the second row.

Quote ="tvoc"Like this you mean: Senior: 86 - 14 (6.14) - 35 - 0 (100%) - 0 - 0 viewtopic.php?f=17&t=469793 As that is the only occasion Senior has been asked to start in the second row I'm not altogether sure what you are basing your opinion on.'" The Hull game sprang to my mind too. But it was a game, unlike most this year, where we weren't tested and it was a stroll. So it may not be the 'everyday example' to judge on. But as you aluded to it is the only example avaiable for your stat analysis. I can see where the former poster was coming from, when you think of Senior on song bursting down the left, it screams classic centre play (however those days may be just behind him this season) compared to the natural attributes of Delaney which is sheer leg drive with strong metre making and very good front on one-on-one tackling, which to me screams 'second row'.

Quote ="tvoc"Like this you mean: Senior: 86 - 14 (6.14) - 35 - 0 (100%) - 0 - 0 viewtopic.php?f=17&t=469793 As that is the only occasion Senior has been asked to start in the second row I'm not altogether sure what you are basing your opinion on.'" The Hull game sprang to my mind too. But it was a game, unlike most this year, where we weren't tested and it was a stroll. So it may not be the 'everyday example' to judge on. But as you aluded to it is the only example avaiable for your stat analysis. I can see where the former poster was coming from, when you think of Senior on song bursting down the left, it screams classic centre play (however those days may be just behind him this season) compared to the natural attributes of Delaney which is sheer leg drive with strong metre making and very good front on one-on-one tackling, which to me screams 'second row'.

I think you'll struggle to find a left centre who makes more tackles than Senior.

It's that his defensive reading of the game is so good that lets us play the system of compressing the opposition to our right so well.

Not as I recall. The week after a draining experience of a massive under-perform at Wembley. 12-0 behind at half-time, only hitting the front for the first time 11 mins from the end and then needing a miraculous one on one ball steal from McGuire on Yeaman on the Leeds line to stay in front.

Senior defensively was outstanding.

Senior still put in two or three outstanding performances at centre also last year tvoc.

But we are now 2011 mate.

Sorry mate, I misunderstood. I was recalling the Hull away this year, and was thinking of Delaney at second row.

Ignore me........if you can.

I think the idea of Senior at Second row flies. Though the style of defending is very different. There is obviously more tarffic, but there is also more support, and against less agile opponents.

Ball in hand, he'd be able to do a better job, than I think he is currently doing out wide.

If he is to play 2nd row, it has to be on merit, and there are a few other people comepeting with him for thos 3 or 4 spots

My reply was to a post concerning Senior's likely defensive performance if moved into the second row. The link was to the only occasion this has been tried by Leeds in a starting line-up before. That game was twelve matches ago.

I know, you stuck to the facts.






Are you a politician tvoc.

I toyed with the idea of using 'eight months' but decided '12 matches' sounded even more recent given the off-season inbetween.

I have been thinking that Senior should not be in a full team, full stop. But I'm coming round to the idea of him as an impact 40-50 minute back-rower.

1) His defence nearer the middle will be solid, and his workrate is good. Nobody runs over or through him, and his defensive problems have been about positioning and leaving gaps out wide which he now can't cover by his old speed off the mark.

2) He can still run hard, draw defenders, and hit gaps up the middle, particularly if he comes on fresher against tiring defences.

3) Less opportunity for flick-passes straight into the crowd.

All told, for this year I think he'll offer a lot more as number 16 or 17 than Clarkson, Pitts or Kirke.

if all else fails laugh.