Agree with this.

Zoo Zoo, I hope you're not an accountant! The spine had 25% of its first choice lineup. Only one player, O'Connor out of four would be first choice. In any event the "%" is less important than the experience/ability of those we had. That was Hooley's 7th SL game. Sinfield's 10th and he clearly isn't ready for SL. Martin isn't even a halfback.

Even that doesn't really tell the story. Put any one of them in Sts team for one of Welsby/Dodd/Lomax and they'd probably look above average. Put all three in Sts team and I'm pretty sure Sts would look bang average on attack, regardless of what "structure" Sts are coached to, because as a unit they aren't even Championship standard if we're honest. They did OK against a Hull team that is probably as keen for the season to be over as we are, but Wigan and Cats are gearing up for the play offs. I suspect we'll get beaten quite easily by Cas as well, as even if our forwards put in a shift (which they clearly did not against Cats) we just don't have many points in us if they defend with determination.

The only way we can compete with the spine we have is by being as physical as possible and trying to keep errors low. There won't be much in the way of flowing moves because we don't have the players to do it. Sadly the forwards haven't been willing to get stuck in as a unit, and our threequarters tend to make bad decisions as well.

I think I’d go:

Hooley
Fus, Newman, J Smith, Handley
F McCormack, Sinfield
Mik, Johnson, Holroyd
McDonnell, Martin
C Smith

Walters, Lisone, O’Connor, Donaldson

Depending on who is fit. If we were a car tyre we would be illegal. I would run with everyone in their favoured positions as much as possible.

Swap hooley for edgell and Walters for Gannon as he isn’t here next year

I mentioned the Academy back line in another thread, i like them all, there are no cant miss prospects in the Watkins/Ward bracket, but theres plenty of Size, skill and athletic potential in the whole group

Lumb
Tchembembe
Smith
N McCormack
Frater
F McCormack
Sinfield

Im also a big fan of hooker Mason Corbett

Max Simpson is the obvious one, fingers crossed he can fully recover and have an injury free run.

I have been consistent on one particular intake since they first joined the Scholarship, and thats the bunch that have recently moved up to the Academy, Excellent bunch with some absolute quality 6 or 7 players deep, and really good players even deeper into the group. Thats where i think we have our real potential stars.

How far off are each of those kids Matts? 2-3 years at least?

Yeah most likely pal, the group with the star potential is 2 groups behind Sinfield, Smith, Lumb, N McCormack, Tchembembe etc so a while off yet

It all comes back to if Rohan got the boot in the off season who do we try and get to replace him? Who's actually available with experience to fill the role?

Rowley.

Of the spine 1,6,7,9,13 we had O'Connor and Smith i.e. 9 and 13 so that is 2 out of 5 I would suggest that is 40%. Perhaps your abacus wasn't working or you need to return to school for upgraded maths lessons.

On the forwards I agree with you - poor players with no heart for the battle or are trying to send a message to the coach?

Good call - he wouldn't take any crap from the likes of Newman

13 isn't in the spine. The spine is 1,6,7 and 9.

As an aside, years ago I remember listening to a discussion about why British halfbacks are generally useless, and one of the reasons they suggested was the British obsession with ball handling 13s. At the time I thought that was OTT, having been brought up watching Norton, Heron, Crane, Hanley etc, but I do think its part of the problem. Cleary, DCE, Reynolds etc do not need any 'help' setting up plays from a lumbering forward with the odd pass. Some Aussie forwards can pass really well (Wade Graham for example), but generally the 13 is a mobile prop in the NRL, and its been that way for decades.

If you asked all the people on here what is the spine everyone apart from yourself they would say 1,6,7,9 &13. We must agree to differ on that. Most on here would see Cameron Smith as ball playing forward.

The NRL is a different game to here far more evolved - the back row is 3 players most of the 13's in the NRL are closer to a second row forward than a prop i.e. fast running forward that has footwork and passing skills not just another battering ram. How best describes Carrigan at the Broncos who plays Lock as they call the 13 - a prop or a second row forward?

13 isn’t a spine player

Nope, loose forward isn't a spine position any more. The modern role of the fullback has replaced it. Still useful to have a 13 who can play a bit though.

I stand corrected

Lots of rumours going round as there will be in times like this .rumours of Ill disciplin turning up late for training or not turning up at all .

Yep its Rowley for me too

Gannon is a standoff now so not really likely.

This schtick of yours is getting tiresome now, thank god it’s the off season soon.

Have you met my wife?

Take the point but Cameron Smith has his hands on the ball more than our halves or FB this year so he is a spine player at Leeds.

He should watch that LF, Yeo at Penrith he is often second receiver, gets deep into the line before passing.class act.

Next year for me Cam Smiyh needs to speed up his passing and need 2 halves that at times tell him to get out of the way.

I’m a McCormack fan but you can’t play him at SL level and I don’t think Rohan Smith will. He is nowhere near ready.

Agree, I think it's come to the point where he has become a spine player because of the complete dearth, especially of late, of natural organisers. Next year that should be sorted and I'd like to see him try to play through the line more. He's not without size and if he can develop a round the back offload he can set himself apart from many of his peers in the English game.

You are probably right. I really like the way he plays - not the same as Danny Mags but offers a real running threat and skilful too.