Give it a year and you might kill for Garry as a coach

Bring back Dean Lance

We don't need racial cleansing adding to the list of problems.

I bet Paul Sterling is still faster than our two winger even at 50+

couple of leeds players in that team told me it was them didn't want sterling in the team. not well liked at all by all accounts.
and by picking other black players week in week out id say it was sterling playing the race card more than lance. not that I rated him as a coach mind

There is always two sides to every story

Back to the game, and I have to say the biggest let-down was the pack. We'd lost two of our playmakers, and were always going to struggle to play with any fluency as a result. Leigh were a week from the cup final - the first for most of their squad. The way to play that game was make it as physical as possible. It won't work every game, but I reckon if the pack (plus our bigger backs like Macdonald, Martin and Roberts) had really aimed up in both attack and defence some of the Leigh players wouldn't have wanted a bar of it.

As it was we were our usual passive selves up front. Leigh must have felt it was Christmas.

The reason this worries me is because I don't see the lack of fluency with the ball changing much before the end of the year, or at least until Myler is back. That means the pack has to take on more responsibility as a group to give us a real chance of winning games (along with a strong kicking game), and I just don't see the current set doing that.

Same questions not answered by the pack the previous week against a Saints team missing Walmsley, Paasi and Matautia. TBF the pack did enough to keep us in both games. We just don't have any game changers in the team to take advantage of field position when we get it.

Even the nostalgia isn’t what it used to be.

Cameron Smith kills any fluency the attack has - his involvement in the attack needs to be curtailed and quickly. He is an excellent defender but his delusional state that he is the next Kevin Sinfield needs extinguishing.

On the forward Oldeski has been a huge disappointment this season - his attempt to stop Amone or lack of it was embarrassing - leaving Hooley to deal with a man 5 stones heavier than him two metres out.

Both of these players are sacred cows on here so their actions or lack of them are excused or ignored.

I agree that Smith stifles the attack at times but I think part of that reason is that our half backs have been so poor. They either don't want to take control or offer nothing when they do. I thought Gale and Lui were a better option than Sezer and Austin.
What makes you believe that Smith thinks he is the next Sinfield?

It is obvious he sees himself as a ball playing loose forward in the Sinfield style. He wants to be involved in every attacking move without the skill and guile to justify it. He came with a huge reputation i.e. the best youngster of his generation - sadly that early promise has not materialised.

One of the reasons the half backs can't operate properly is because of Smith's involvement. He is a bit like Dwyer - a loose cannon who cannot contribute to the attack in a positive fashion.

Great defender who gives 100% everytime he gets on the field - just reduce his involvement in the attack.

I think there have been multiple games Smith has had the balance right this year. The last two he has got it well wrong but I’m inclined to say that’s because the half backs aren’t stepping up consistently enough and feels like he has to.

Mik hasn’t looked the same this year I’ll agree with that.

I thought Smith was the best British forward for the first part of the season, with the possible exception of Havard. His loss of form has coincided with him trying to do all the creative work of the team in the absence of anyone else. Sinfield had the luxury of Burrow & McGuire around him.

Smith's effective in attack at times but not when he's in the line at 2nd or 3rd receiver. Doesn't have the pace or much of a kicking game; all he can do is shift it on or take the tackle. But in semi broken play around the ruck he can be great. Providing there are runners prepared to rake it in hard and make the effort to pick good running lines of course.

The same people were creating at the beginning of the year as we have now - up until last week. We don't give credit to coaches who have worked him out and that may well explain his lack of impact. They know he is slow so its easy to nullify him - teams take time in a season to get organised e.g. Hull.

That's a fair point. But I would say coaches have worked out the team rather than just Smith, which has put more onus on Smith. You had 2 of the most highly regarded HB imports (not anymore obvs) who, apart from an impressive mid-season spell from Austin, have created nothing. Their stats are terrible in virtually every department. Smith impressed me in defence & breakdown, not just attack.

I'd say Smith's problems are similar to why our halfbacks struggle - lack of shape and structure in attack. He's got the ability to play the sort of role Knocker Norton used to for Hull, but when he was there Hull played with a lot of shape.

Smith can't be a very effective ball handler if every time he gets the ball the whole team is making it up, because he hasn't got the pace (or alternatively physical punch) to be any kind of threat. The way we play I reckon an opposition defence would almost deliberately encourage Leeds to pass to Smith and then just take away his space as he gets the ball. What's he going to do - run away from defenders? Knock them over and make a break? Or just die lamely with the ball? I think we all know what tends to happen.

Yeah agree. Whilst Smith is one of the slowest forwards I’ve seen in the league, he can be a very skill full link, with good structured and pace around him. We definitely need to utilise his assets more…..

He's a bit like Knocker in slow motion in attack. When we played that Hull side of the early mid-80s I was worried every time Knocker got the ball from first receiver in our 20; you expected something to come from it with his mobility & handling. Smith's not quite at that level yet.

Smith needs bodies in motion around him providing options. That keeps the defence occupied. Sounds like in attack Leeds are making it up as they go along but don't have the tools to do it properly. That's allowing the defensive side to dictate what you do in attack.

This is exactly what is happening, and it’s infuriating to watch. It’s like asking an amateur tennis player to go play like Roger Federer.

I agree, Knocker had better footwork but you and others are right he needs runners and I think needs telling to simply pass the ball to better strike players more often.
McDonald is a strong runner but we never put him in a gap.
He’s also not helped by how static we are in general.

See that, that’s poor coaching that is. Either Smith is telling the players to do what you said and they aren’t doing it, or he’s not telling them. Either way, over the course of a season, it’s more than just players on their own.

Cameron Smith looking right , not passing, stepping inside and getting caught with the ball is happening far too often, you are right a coach should be into his ribs . You can’t do that 12 plus times a game next week or I’ll drop you, get other players to tell him as well and vitally give him options. Cameron has skill and good hands but it needs speeding up . Danny McGuire would have been perfect for him, because he’d be at him all game.