4 years jail sentence for the pair that posted a group on fancebook asking people to riot.

That's ridiculous. People in this country commit murder and wind up not serving significantly longer in jail, someone posts something on the internet and get's 4 years.

Our justice system is disproportionate.

One of the major problems today is with parenting.

Teenage pregnancies are a dime a dozen, parents no longer have the same power they once did. If a kid can't respect his parents how will they respect any other authority figures in life?

Theres no strong authoritarian figures, so kids can pretty much do what they want and get away with it. Theres no respect. Zero.

Respect and discipline needs to be instilled in a chile from an early age or they will run riot. Parents aren't able to, or aren't capable of doing that these days.

Only one more point to make and then I'm done with trying to explain to those who will not listen, as you have already pointed out, only three people in the whole country believe that this will not lead to a reduction in service levels and two of them know they are lying.

Anyway - "natural wastage" equates to a reduction in numbers, whether front line or back office, with a freeze on recruitment these last two years and for the foreseeable future, every retiree equals one more member of police staff who is lost to the service - some people seem to think that less bodies on the ground offers a better service, some people think that cheaper is better, we will wait and see.

I think people are overlooking the semantics in all those Official Statements.

The Chief Police Officers state that a budget reduction will result in a drop in the the number of frontline Officers. And that is all they say. They leave it to the public to immeadiately conclude, less Officers equals less Police protectection available, ergo we are all at risk from maurading hordes of disadvantaged youths excercising their right to be different.

What they don't acknowledge is that perhaps with a better deployment of their resources, they could still hit their service targets.

I'll give you an example here in leeds. The other year down in York Place 2 PCSO's were talking to a rough sleeper who had spent the night down in one of the basement entraces. A couple of mins later 2 police vans arrived, and out popped 6 or 7 proper coppers to arrest the guy, who was sat quietly on the kerb edge.

Now,I've no idea if this guy was a mad axeman with previous, or if one van simply saw the other and came down to have a nosey. But what I did observe was half a dozen coppers, plus 2 PCSO's, plus 2 vans to arrest and transport one down and out back to the nick. Where no doubt there would be a Custody Sergeant, and the room full of uniforms needed to process the prisoner. By the time he made it to Court I wonder how many uniformed personnel had been involved to get him there..

Without knowing the full story, its impossible to say that this is the normal level of response, but on that showing, would the loss of 20% of the manpower involved result in a poorer service?

PS just spotted [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11601537THIS[/url. Looks like some joined up thinking at last on the idea of a single procurement Agency