He's young with a long way to go before anyone's opinion can be fairly assessed. Someone once said it was too early to judge Joe Vickery and events almost immediately showed in his case it weren't too early at all.

The conditions were slow tonight which suited Lilley. First time I noticed him take the line on was mid-way through the second half, then again around ten from the end. His place kicks all went over, he reacted to the ricochet well and did equally well to get over. He's had other individual moments in other games too this season but nothing yet to convince me he isn't the latest Paul McShane clone.

I'm also still not seeing what the fuss is regarding Golding. He had one good moment recovering the kick that sat up in-goal but spent the rest of the match running sideways and backwards on kick returns while frightening the life out of Hardaker by threatening passes (thankfully didn't follow through) while looking afraid to take contact.

Leeds' best IMO were Burrow, Jones-Buchanan, Keinhorst and Hardaker. Two welcome and unexpected points, hopefully they'll be more of those in the coming weeks.

TRANSLATION

"I've slagged Lilley off before so I've got to stick to it regardless of performance"

Lilley put in a lot of effort tonight and came up with a crucial try and held his nerve with kicks but I did feel he lacked a bit of quality with some of his kicks, when he was rushed they seemed to go a bit wayward. That is why Burrow was MotM imo as he helped out with kicks at crucial times.
Sutcliffe on the other hand had a few good touches (and some not so good ones) but was not involved enough.

I think it might be worth them switching positions, Sutcliffe at first reciever getting more involved with Lilley acting as a foil and an organisor in the way DCE and Foran used to operate.
Nt sure what to do when Mcguire is back tbh, could play with Mcguire replacing either of the roles mentioned above.

Keinhorst was great, he should be somewhere in the 17 no matter who is fit in the next few weeks. Handly is also pushing for a place although he needs to bulk up a bit. Golding clearly isnt a winger but didnt let anyone down, for the first. Hardaker was far from perfect but put in everything, as did JJB.

I've commented on Lilley before, I've commented on Lilley and other performances tonight. If you've got opinions on Lilley to share then feel free. I've yet to see anything to get over excited about.

I've yet to see anything to be massively critical about too, yet you were on here like a dog with two d!cks post WCC almost celevbrating his missed conversion and telling us he'll be at Fev/Hunslet soon.

Lilley will improve he is only 19, most halves dont emerge fully until they are 23/24 especially ones whos games arent based on pace.

Golding is not a winger, cant see how you can criticise him really, again he is 19 and will bulk up for kick returns.

Doesn't sound like something I'd do but sounds like something you'd claim others do.

My comments probably to counter-balance some over the top praise handed down to anyone who can tie their own shoe laces without falling over such is Leeds fans desperation to find cheap saviours. What I saw and commented on was a half-back with no pace (an aspect unlikely to be acquired with maturity) which IMO will severely limit their effectiveness without offering a running threat. Other aspects would need to be exceptional in time to survive at a club like Leeds.

If he's going to be a prospect I'd like to see him given an extended run in a settled position but with McGuire/Burrow still to accommodate I can't see that happening.

You were formidable,given the atroutious conditions you grinded a win out.Hudds beat the Wire in similar fashion,so the win counts for nothing..Personally I thought Lilley played very well.

Re Golding, it doesn't particularly matter whether he's a winger or not - he was safe, he carried the ball securely, he ran - my issue with him remains that he ran sideways way too much (Joe Vickery-like) and looks unhappy when taking contact, offensively and defensively. Without he finds an appetite for that I think he's going to struggle. I don't buy the age argument as there have been and are plenty of lads that age more than happy with the physical nature of the sport.

The win counts for two points, same as any other win. The aim is to be 8th or higher in twelve games time - who knows whether Leeds or Huddersfield will be in that contest or who the other clubs might be. That said, would have preferred a Huddersfield loss.

Don't play the neutral poster, it doesn't work with those of us who have good memories.....you delighted in criticising him for not landing the 2 vs NQC and then saying how he'll end up in the Championship or lower.

A halfback with no pace you say? No, that'll never work.

Golding has all the attributes to become a big star. He has pace, good hands ability to make clean breaks, is brave and is a heads up attacking player who finds space and holds the ball in two hands. That you are unable to spot these skills is unfortunate as is your belief that looking to make contact is an asset. Attacking back play is all about avoiding contact and seeking space which you seem to equate with being unhappy with contact.

It is all just opinion of course as was the time you rubbished a very young Owen Farrell.

My initial thought was how are hull 3rd. Was a low quality game (weather assisted) Keinhorst looked good,full of enthusiasm. I have been massively critical of burrow this season but thought he had one of his better games. JJB got stuck in and when Mags returns sutcliffe should be making way for him. Once again non involvement from him. Lilley looked the more creative HB of the two

Lilley is a good young prospect with those creative attacking half back skills that are all too rare these days. Yes he is a little short of pace but so were many good half backs over the years. He has the ability to create opportunities on the last tackle particularly close to their line. Something we have sadly lacked this year. He should be given an extended run with McGuire when he returns. Burrow showed last night that he should be at 9 too.

Very true. One of the greatest in my lifetime, Wally Lewis was pretty slow yet a genius with the ball in his hands.

Thought you deserved the win, as you were smarter with the ball and much more disciplined, we should have killed the game after halftime when we were in control and causing you loads of problems through the middle.

Burrow is real threat from acting half and needs to stay there, maybe a tough win is what you needed we did that against Rovers and we kicked in from there.

For the first time, I could see the future for Galloway in this team. He dominated some big opposition last night.

That's always the argument people trot out with Lewis. It's true, he wasn't going to run the length but he had deceptive pace over 10-20 metres and could leave defenders flat footed. All that's needed for a half. He was also built like a tank and could run like one.

Couldn't fault the effort from both sides in a very entertaining game. We probably wanted it more, Hull were better organised with the ball I thought but we managed to put more pressure on them and we matched their big men. Everybody got stuck in.
The issues this season for me have been around linking backs and forwards together and looking like we know what we are doing with the ball. The conditions gave us a game where that issue was not a major factor.
Lots of the guys really gave everything last night, Hardaker was fantastic, really stood up. Burrow was a menace from dummy half and I thought Keinhorst was excellent, particularly in the first half.

The conditions definitely suited the team that were struggling to be effective with the ball but who were desperate to win a home game. You don't often hope for a wet summer but ......

Didn't see the game and cannot imagine Leeds have suddenly turned things around in a high quality game, though perhaps someone will chip in and confirm that it was all those things and more?



Well done Leeds - a much needed win in circumstances where two points matter more than the performance.

As for the Jordan Lilley V Wally Lewis comparison above?

Oh dear

My view on the halves is that Sutcliffe gets slated because he runs the ball to much but doesn't run a game and get involved enough.

Lilley gets stick because he is small and lacks pace and has little running threat.

Between the two of them there is enough to make a good pairing. get the forwards on the front foot and give them a good run in the team before writing the pair off for leaving attributes the other has

You might actually have enjoyed it. Some very big lads, some very big collisions. Despite the conditions both sides controlled the ball well. Fast game as well.
Leeds did look relatively clueless near the Hull line (although Keinhorst's try was real quality - even on a dry night), Hull were much better organised, but both sides defended very well.

Is Lilley the new Paul Deacon? With blood streaming from his face it was slightly reminiscent of a certain incident involving Nigel Vagana (although thankfully not as bad).

No pace, good kicker, small of stature...

Then again, has anyone else noticed he seems to have the facial features of Graham Holroyd?

The pace that really matters is the speed of thought that is what separates the top players from the rest. SInfield was never the quickest around the park but he was one of the quickest in assessment of a situation that is what made him a great player.

McGuire has scored heaps of tries by being in the right place at the right time that is not a fluke that is about mental agility and being able to read the game. Raw speed is a great asset but it is not what separates the best players from the rest