I Thought and hoped that Silverwood had blown his chance after his poor showing last Friday. A bit like Thaler lost out on Wembley (IMHO) after his 'errors' in our CC Semi v Wigan.

I was hoping for Thaler for Saturday but expecting Ganson who I still feel would be better for us than Silverwood.

I know all refs get abuse and all make mistakes but it just seems over recent seasons (possibly since the WCC v Melbourne) that his 'style' doesnt fit well with us or at least certain players?

He absolutely did his best to give Wigan that game last friday. And failed.

Guess we have to play against 14 again this saturday - bring it on

While we're on the subject of refs and reffing decisions can anyone explain whether I have the following right or not

Friday's game about 54 minutes:

Wigan kick to corner
Charnley palms ball back to Goulding
Goulding kicks ahead
Hall knocks on attempting to pick ball up, scrum Wigan.....but

Charnley was in front of Goulding and within 10m of Hall so surely it shold have been offside, penalty Leeds

None of the commentary team picked it up, but I've watched the replay and I'm sure it should have been our ball

Are you talking about the one where he was downtown at the PTB tvoc? If so Thaler got that right. If you are downtown at the PTB you can't be brought back on-side from a kick or by the kicker. If not that one then I am lost at which one you mean, but I was watching and working at the same time.

I'm not that concerned as to which referee takes charge of the GF as i have witnessed plenty of GF's which have been allowed to be refereed and under completely different rules when compared to what gets penalised in the weekly rounds

Sides standing Off-side, players holding down in the tackle, players not standing square at the PTB and other minor indiscretions are clearly ignored on this day by the referee, I just hope that both sides get the same leeway

The Video referee clearly has a sole objective each week of delivering the correct decision on what he sees in each individual incident based on his interpretations

However their interpretations clearly vary on a weekly basis and all SL sides have been robbed of games throughout the season

I hope that Saturday's game isn't one that will be decided by either of the officiating party in control

Cast your mind back 12 months to an offside decision given against Richie Myler which gave you the lead with seconds to go. Would you say that Myler had every right to pressure Sinfield seeing as he was going for the match winning drop goal? Both very marginal decisions, but 12 months ago, considering the Myler decision was handing the match to Leeds, pedantic beyond belief.

Other than it being an offside decision nothing else that occurred in the 'downtown' incident fitted my description so probably not.

As you say the downtown decision was correct. It appeared to be touch judge Robert Hicks who made the call indeed you can pick him up communicating with Thaler - 'Makinson downtown' on the Sky broadcast.



If you have access to the SL Fulltime program - not sure if it's available online - it was covered quite well on there.

According to the studio guests the score was 14 - 18 at the time. St Helens were cramming Warrington into a corner restricting yardage. St Helens line speed was very good and they were a fair ten metres from the Warrington play the ball although Thaler was stood more than ten when he penalised for offside.

It was a perfect example of what McDermott was bemoaning the previous night.

After the penalty Warrington kicked to touch took one hit-up through Ben Harrison and then shifted the ball left through Myler to Atkins who stepped clear and got an offload away inside to Waterhouse who finished strongly. Game over - St Helens never got another look in until the contest was over, IMO.

This is the best summary of the situation - the Leeds players and Silverwood just can't get a decent relationship going, certainly a referee like Thaler has a much better on field rapport with players of all teams which is important to get them to do what you want with least bother. At best, like on Friday, the players control themselves and just ignore him. But that can be remarkably difficult. At worst, Sinfield and other players start having a word and then that just makes it worse.

Whose fault is that? I don't know - but as referee your player management and game management is crucial and the ongoing difficulties Leeds have had with this referee since that Keith Senior incident makes it a concern.

Thaler has a habit of pinging players for offside when defending their own line if their feet are over the line just a little bit, NOW THAT IS PEDANTIC.

If from an onside position at the play the ball certainly.

From memory it was a close call by Ganson but Myler looked like he'd set off before the Leeds player (McGuire) had placed the ball on the ground to play it. Again IIRC the call actually came from touch judge James Child (you know the one some Leeds fans don't appear to like) and Mr Ganson made absolutely sure the Warrington players were aware of who (not Ganson) had made the decision.

I don't think it helped when Warrington came up with the ball (Jon Clarke?) after Myler's charge-down and perhaps if Leeds had got possession back Ganson would have ignored the marginal shout from the side-line and waved for another set instead.

Either way a pity the game ended by ultimately being more or less decided in that fashion with a referee's call.

Unless you are Jamie Peacock and he ignores it completely.

Pretty sure Benthams a Leigh fan

One thing I noticed when i watched the game back on Monday night, Wigans 2nd try, not only was Lunt robbed completely as Goulding purposely knocked the ball out and Lunt ajudged to have knocked on. But just before this, Goulding the tackler in the previous play was knowhere near square, in fact he was about half a metre to the left, which enabled him to get Lunt (penalty Leeds) knock the ball out, which Lunt regathered (play on). But Silverwood knows best eh. And the linesman?? Pointless!

Am I the only one who thinks having Silverwood in charge may actually favour us?

Warrington have the ability to really hurt us and get a roll on. I personally think that a ref who allows a second more wrestle plays into Leeds' hands more than Wire's. The grand final is a grind game, where it is toughed out. Leeds are used to that, and can handle a slower ruck with the ball, but it will allow us extra time to sort our defence out to keep Warrington from our line

Nope, you're not the only one. This thought crossed my mind too.

Then again, consistency seems to vary not only from ref to ref but from week to week. I wouldn't be surprised to see Silverwood pull us up for things he was ignoring only last week.

Possibly a function of refs being talked through previous performances and are told "You missed that" or "You weren't too hot on that" .... So, next game they go out of their way to show they are addressing what they have been told were faults in their refereeing. To fans/coaches watching, it's seen as 'inconsistent' that last game a certain ref couldn't care less about offside/interfering at ruck, but this game he's clamping down on it.

Maybe the refs are in a no-win situation ... (oh gawd, I'm almost showing sympathy for refs!)

I suspect you're right. My preference would be to let refs interpret as they see fit, whereby teams get to learn what each ref does and doesn't want to see. The one problem would be Alibert; he'd have to let the teams know how many tackles there were going to be in each set otherwise there'd be chaos.

Marginal? Don't make me laugh. Puletua is either twice as quick as Usain Bolt or he and several other were well offside. The fact is that Thaler missed many more offsides previous to that one, but he at least got this one right.

I hope he allows lots of lying on with a susequent lack of quick PTB's .....otherwise we're fooked

but hasn't he had a tendency to allow only our opposition to slow the play the ball and penalised us

yep. appallingly one sided at wembley and last week. that nice mr cummings bollocked him for failing to do the job properly last week so is giving him another chance this week.

Puletua had been involved in the previous tackle and was stood at marker.

Apart from the markers the St Helen's defensive line was stood a fair ten metres back as the ball was played although as I previously noted Thaler was stood deeper.

Hopefully the referee will have taken some instruction this week on how to measure an accurate ten metres if he expects the players to be in line.

It was shaping up to be a treemendou defensive set before Thaler intervened and two tackles later Waterhouse was rubber stamping the game changing moment.

you should know its not actually about how far back you should be, rather how far back the ref says you should be

Am I following your logic correctly here...because Sinfield was going for a match winning drop goal Myler has every right to be offside and it's harsh to award a match winning penalty in return for denial of a match winning drop goal?

Can I have some of what you're drinking