I like Cam Smith as a person, I like his guts in defence as a player. You can see the Lee Crooks influence. He’s no Dave Heron.

Awful, but not suprising, if theres one thing you can guarantee, when this group of players are confident, they are over confident, and serve up a stit show every time. Pathetic, brain dead, bunch who think they're better than they are

Wakey fan in peace. After pounding us and looking 3 gears quicker than us in the first half on Boxing Day, then obviously watching the highlights of your game against Wigan I genuinely thought you’d be pushing top 4. You were completely nullified yesterday, Frawley was atrocious (never rated him) and in my opinion the most overrated english players in SL Connor, Bentley and Newman were atrocious too. Handley is not a centre but is a class winger. If you look at the Wakefield trinity stats which are easy to find you’ll see why you were beat. It was a clinical workman like team performance that beat you and the score was flattering. If everything clicks you have some team, but by that performance you look like you have too many individuals and not a team.

Cam poked his nose through a couple of times. Was ok going forward but has a bad habit of slowing the ball as a pivot.

[quote="Barrie’s Glass Eye":tor5aas7]Cam poked his nose through a couple of times. Was ok going forward but has a bad habit of slowing the ball as a pivot.[/quote:tor5aas7] He wants to watch back how 35 year old Pitts played yesterday. That’s why he’s never been in or around the England RL set up. His ball playing ability isn’t there, he’s one dimensional, just carried forward and stagnates the attack. He’s a powerful running 13, but a quality international 13 he is not. Dare say his brother was a better play playing forward.

Was really hoping for a noticeable difference after the "Brad Arthur effect" hype, most of the issues still there sadly.

The video ref and lino had shockers surely the wingers legs were on the floor over the touch line when he passes the ball? Still I thought we were second best. Trueman bosses the game in the fist half and the wakey props outplayed ours.

[quote="Pat Bateman":1wp3u0bh]Wakey fan in peace. After pounding us and looking 3 gears quicker than us in the first half on Boxing Day, then obviously watching the highlights of your game against Wigan I genuinely thought you’d be pushing top 4. You were completely nullified yesterday, Frawley was atrocious (never rated him) and in my opinion the most overrated english players in SL Connor, Bentley and Newman were atrocious too. Handley is not a centre but is a class winger. If you look at the Wakefield trinity stats which are easy to find you’ll see why you were beat. It was a clinical workman like team performance that beat you and the score was flattering. If everything clicks you have some team, but by that performance you look like you have too many individuals and not a team.[/quote:1wp3u0bh] All fair points nothing much to disagree with there. Think Wakey will go well this season, expected so much more from our lot.

[quote="Broadacres":2nlrlrnf]Was really hoping for a noticeable difference after the "Brad Arthur effect" hype, most of the issues still there sadly.[/quote:2nlrlrnf] He is a high quality coach, nothing to blame now but the poor quality players. Too many still not good enough and never will be. Connor Newman Frawley Ackers Bentley Smith just the tip of the iceberg, connor will get a right hounding this season unless he improves massively.

The whole 'culture' thing at Leeds just seems so forced and not authentic I think thats a big problem, that they're trying to create something thats very cliche and corporate. Following Leeds (even from your sofa) has become a pretty depressing pastime. With way more resources than petty much every other club they keep getting it wrong. Think I'm logging out for my own health til signs are we might see a return to better days..

[quote="rollin thunder":3rct4f47]He is a high quality coach, nothing to blame now but the poor quality players. Too many still not good enough and never will be. Connor Newman Frawley Ackers Bentley Smith just the tip of the iceberg, connor will get a right hounding this season unless he improves massively.[/quote:3rct4f47] Not really blaming him, just disappointed with the performance, if he can't get a tune out of these players, not sure who could.

[quote="rollin thunder":2y2ia3f9]All fair points nothing much to disagree with there. Think Wakey will go well this season, expected so much more from our lot.[/quote:2y2ia3f9] I expected a lot more too, especially after Boxing Day and the Wigan friendly, coupled with Brad Arthur as your coach. I just believe you have some incredibly overrated players ie Bentley, Newman and Connor. Your team will forever be compared to the glory days that seem a long time ago now. What’s happening with you guys is eerily similar to Manchester Utd, trying to buy success…… well it’s either that or you just got outplayed by us who evidently are decent and have a boat load of confidence coming up from the championship (like Leigh did) and performed really well.

[quote="Broadacres":pxs3nruo]Not really blaming him, just disappointed with the performance, if he can't get a tune out of these players, not sure who could.[/quote:pxs3nruo] Merlin The Wizard ? I think we’ve got to accept nobody can change the physical profile or inherent poor decision making of the vast majority of this squad. We may have a chance with the likes of Gannon and Lumb, but what you see is what you get basically with the rest of them. Motivation should never be an area for massive improvement at this level, the players should have been out of the door ages ago if they were lacking in that department. Maybe all the temporary rebuilds have got us all believing that bringing in new mediocre players as a replacement for other mediocre players will somehow work.

[quote="Pat Bateman":36jq2th2]I expected a lot more too, especially after Boxing Day and the Wigan friendly, coupled with Brad Arthur as your coach. I just believe you have some incredibly overrated players ie Bentley, Newman and Connor. Your team will forever be compared to the glory days that seem a long time ago now. What’s happening with you guys is eerily similar to Manchester Utd, trying to buy success…… well it’s either that or you just got outplayed by us who evidently are decent and have a boat load of confidence coming up from the championship (like Leigh did) and performed really well.[/quote:36jq2th2] The trying to buy success thing is something all sides with the resource to do so try. Wakey included these days. Sometimes the signings turn out well, sometimes not. Worse case, you're stuck with an iffy player 3 years max, probably less, who you then replace. Of far greater consequence is average quality home grown retained for multiple years. Obviously they help generate the culture but if they're mediocre talents then results will reflect this.

[quote="Clearwing":3rsdqg79]The trying to buy success thing is something all sides with the resource to do so try. Wakey included these days. Sometimes the signings turn out well, sometimes not. Worse case, you're stuck with an iffy player 3 years max, probably less, who you then replace. Of far greater consequence is average quality home grown retained for multiple years. Obviously they help generate the culture but if they're mediocre talents then results will reflect this.[/quote:3rsdqg79] I don’t agree. There’s a difference in trying to buy success and trying to create a culture to have prolonged sustainable success. Powell and Ste Mills have made it no secret the number one thing they look at when they sign a player is his personality. We are with the new backing starting to create a top culture to then hopefully target trophies within the next 5 years. Leeds are targeting trophies now instead of getting their house in order. Having the likes of Connor, Bentley and Newman who are well known to be marmite characters won’t help this. These types of players would have been no where near the Leeds team of old. You’re losing your identity and we are creating a new one for us.

[quote="Pat Bateman":v6vr1s46]I don’t agree. There’s a difference in trying to buy success and trying to create a culture to have prolonged sustainable success. Powell and Ste Mills have made it no secret the number one thing they look at when they sign a player is his personality. We are with the new backing starting to create a top culture to then hopefully target trophies within the next 5 years. Leeds are targeting trophies now instead of getting their house in order. Having the likes of Connor, Bentley and Newman who are well known to be marmite characters won’t help this. These types of players would have been no where near the Leeds team of old. You’re losing your identity and we are creating a new one for us.[/quote:v6vr1s46] Good posting, certainly food for thought.

It's one game. Let's not get ahead of oursens. Wakey will go well. Leeds will go well.

[quote="DMF":fdojd6s8]It's one game. Let's not get ahead of oursens. Wakey will go well. Leeds will go well.[/quote:fdojd6s8] Agreed, I will reserve judgement until we are seven or eight games into the season. I have mentioned before ,that the Arthur situation isn’t perfect. But we were in dire straits. So Brad was the only realistic option. Our pack yesterday was a huge disappointment, made worse by the fact wakey had a few forwards missing. First half was disastrous, they ran us ragged, three quarters defence absolutely woeful. Wakefield played some good rugby drove the ball up the middle. Then moved it wide very quickly. Quite simple but effective.

If we're going to stop being mediocre then dropping underperformers is a priority. At least we have a few options now. Clark-Wood and Jenkins will come into the team, and hopefully Sinfield/O'Connor. The first priority has to be to sort this pack out. Its been a powderpuff mess for years. Fix that and a lot of the other problems can be solved. Don't and it doesn't matter who else comes in.

[quote="Pat Bateman":z4ebfv7l]I don’t agree. There’s a difference in trying to buy success and trying to create a culture to have prolonged sustainable success. Powell and Ste Mills have made it no secret the number one thing they look at when they sign a player is his personality. We are with the new backing starting to create a top culture to then hopefully target trophies within the next 5 years. Leeds are targeting trophies now instead of getting their house in order. Having the likes of Connor, Bentley and Newman who are well known to be marmite characters won’t help this. These types of players would have been no where near the Leeds team of old. You’re losing your identity and we are creating a new one for us.[/quote:z4ebfv7l] Good post.

At least we managed to keep one skill from last season. The ability to kick the ball straight to a member of the opposition every time. I actually saw the ball hit the grass once from a kick in the second half but missed who kicked the ball. I am sure that a review of the game will allow the coaching team to identify this player and quickly teach this issue out of him.

I do think there's been a bit of an overreaction to the defeat. It was a poor performance, it's the first game, let's see where we are in 7 or 8 weeks time.

[quote="Jack Burton":2y4wh92m]I do think there's been a bit of an overreaction to the defeat. It was a poor performance, it's the first game, let's see where we are in 7 or 8 weeks time.[/quote:2y4wh92m] Absolutely not, that's far too balanced an opinion

[quote="Jack Burton":1otjuocw]I do think there's been a bit of an overreaction to the defeat. It was a poor performance, it's the first game, let's see where we are in 7 or 8 weeks time.[/quote:1otjuocw] But its been the same old same old since 2018 pretty much, we start poor flounder buff and bluster in the middle then fall short, so hard to be optimistic as it already looks like the writing is on the wall. I’m sure we all want to get proven wrong.

More concerning than the result was the performance. If there was evidence of some intelligence or ideas but execution failed then fair enough, however yet again we look like we met in the car park before the game and picked playing positions out of a hat. Edge defence horrific. All the back bar maybe hall poor. We've exciting players when in space yet never attempted to make space for them. Forwards the less said the better. Don't know what people see in cam smith. Wouldn't be disappointed never to see hackers in a Leeds kit again either. Positives though at least some youngsters should get game time next week