I had missed that, what a joke!

Perhaps Flanders may get some input as captain? That might explain it!

Said elsewhere (and it seems I'm not the only one) how the hell has Matty Smith got selected? What exactly has he done to merit selection? Luke Gale has played himself into the squad....he deserves his selection.

I would suggest Matty Smith is not even the best HB at Wigan. Next season they could have Tomkins alongside Williams ....England pairing too if not now then def in the future. They all seem to rate Ryan Hampshire highly for the halves too.

There should be no doubt whatsoever as to who SHOULD be England full back, but sadly, the one person who makes the final decision is a clueless inept . Perfect person for the RFL to put in charge

Still....I'll support Tomkins 100% on the day when he plays.

Tricky one this. I really do think Tomkins is a better player than Hardaker and a better full back. I think Tomkins offers so much more in attack but Hardaker's defence is without question better than Sam's. I do think they should both be accommodated though. Hardaker at FB and Sam at 6. They are both too good to be left out. As much as i rate Cuthbertson i don't want to see him in an England shirt. He is an Aussie. I don't care where his mum's cat was born. Ferres and Smith are joke selections. Smith is being carried by the Wigan team and hopefully will soon find his lever in the lower echelons of SL. He is the reason we cannot progress.

We're in agreement over including Hardaker(FB) AND Tomkins (HB) plus the selections of Ferres and Smith !!! It does appear 2 "top" coaches see something in the latter that most of us seem to have missed !!!! ?

Is cuthbertsons dad a cat?!

Have you heard of a certain Danny Mcguire? He for one should be ahead of Matty Smith

The non-selection of Cuthbertson is an absolute nonsense. There are three specialist props in the 24 man squad, but eight back-rowers and only two centres?

Too many people being selected on reputation (Westwood, Smith, Tomkins). How much SL does McNamara actually watch? Having a coach based 12,000 miles away from most of his players is a shambles.

Ironically, a series defeat to a heavily depleted New Zealand might not be the worst result if it sees the end of this clown as England coach.

I'm a big advocate of the international game and feel the lack of a credible international scene is the only thing that stops our game being the global phenomenon it should be.

However - with the amount of players that have dropped out if the NZ squad, I think this tournament has lost a lot of credibility - and with that in mind, regardless of form or how much our players deserve to be in the squad, I'm quite happy to see as few selected as possible this year... This season has been a long hard slog, and next year is going to be even harder with the changes in the squad and a WCC to contest..... Happy for as many of our squad as possible to have a good long rest....

Could be a major problem selecting smith, nobody can find him at the moment.
He certainly was not at old trafford last night.

Not selecting cuthbertson is bizarre clearly should be in the England team for me. That said if selected think he would pull out. Been playing injured for the last month requiring injections to play. Wouldn't be surprised to see hardaker and Watkins pull out. Both also nursing injuries having injections to play

He selected Tom Burgess, so I'm not sure how much NRL he watches either. Talk about getting by on your surname - Watts, Huby, Singleton and particularly Cuthbertson all miles ahead of him. Probably a few others too.

To be honest, I'd rather have no Leeds players in the England squad.
They deserve a rest

I could be crap playing in the NRL just like Ratboy, does that mean that I should be ahead of Hardaker at FB as well? He's been garbage in the NRL and is up against the MoS so he should be dropped. Widdop and Gale should be 6 & 7.

There are a few selection I don't agree with at all. Smith shouldn't even be getting picked to play for Hunslet Hawks never mind being Englands first choice scrum half, Ferres is there just to make up numbers,Westwood the same, cudjoe is probably last resort at centre for me I don't rate Ben Currie at all and I can't stand Bateman and I don't think he's anything special

Drop all of them then bring in Shenton, Ablett, Mcguire, Cuthbertson, Singleton (for experience) And I think Watts deserves a place

Also get the captaincy away from o'loughlin Graham would be a much better choice

I will continue to regard McGuire as a no 6 not a scrum half.
Personally I'd sooner see him have a full off season than play in a meaningless series vs the Kiwis.
I don't rate Matty Smith either & would rather see Widdop & Tomkins at 6 & 7 with Hardaker at FB.
Of the those I'd consider a true scrum half Gale has been the best English qualified player in that position this season.

The Leeds scrum half played him off the park last night.

he was superb and has been generally all season.Big game player as proved again, and my odds of 14/1 for him to pick up the Harry Sunderland award last night were too good to pass up

Cuthbertson's father was born in Warrington and IMO that puts him as being eligible for England selection,You clearly didn't know this by mentioning his mothers cat's birthplace did you?

Or are you just stupid?

Yes i did know that but he is about as English as Inglis. If a dog was born in a stable you wouldn't call it a horse would you. He was born and raised in Oz, sees himself as an Aussie and will go back over there when he has finished at Leeds.

Good player - Yes.
English - No
Do England really need him anyway - Probably not

If you previously knew Where his father was born then why did you fail to mention it and preferred to mention the mothers cat's birthplace?
How do you know that he will go back to Oz?
How do you know he sees himself as an Aussie?

All those saying Tomkins has been crap in the NRL, have you actually watched him? Because he really hasn't. He's been injured for a lot of this season so there's not much to take from it but in 2014 he was certainly good enough. The NZW fans loved him and believed they were a much better side with him in it.

I don't really see why it has to be either or with Tomkins/Hardaker, the aussies don't have all these crying and moaning over Slater and Inglis. They can both be accommodated and both deserve to. If Tomkins plays Fullback and Hardaker is in the centres then so what? tbh I'd wager that some of the Leeds players might like a rest after this season.

The fact of the matter is Tomkins has proven himself to be class, whilst his defence is not as good as Hardaker's his attack is better in every way (actually maybe not his pace anymore but we'll see) and one dodgy season, due to injury, in a struggling side in the top competition doesn't mean he's overrated and a player.

The aussies have certain lynchpins in their team who are selected every year even though other players may have had better form during the season, Tomkins is one of those for England as is Hall, Roby, Graham, O'Loughlin, Westwood.

Not sure what's gone on with Cuthbertson tbh. He's certainly more English than Rangi Chase ever was. Other England national teams don't seem to have these qualms with the 'integrity of the national side', look at the England cricket team!

It's annoying when players come about with really tenuous links because they can't get in the side for the country they were actually born in, but I'd say one of your parents being English is certainly enough!
England would definitely be better off with him in the side, yes in the NRL he wasn't good enough to get selected for Australia but he looks like an entirely different player and there's some very logical reasons to explain that other than, SL is an 'easier competition'.

Although in principle I agree with you, Hardaker is not a good centre !! His qualities (great kick returns, safety under the high ball and brilliant last line of defence are not things that can be best shown in the centres - he can't pass too good either).
Much better to play Hardaker at FB and have Tomkins in the halves IMO (alongside Williams).

However, best of all I'd rather Hardaker, Watkins and Hall not be selected: they need a good close season rest rather than play in these meaningless matches. Ditto glad Cuthbertson got 'overlooked'

Anything to back this up?

From my understanding NZ Warriors fans thought he'd be better than he actually was and were initially disappointed.