The first eh?

Well if the others we have llined up are like richard moore and ben cross we'd be better off not signing anyone at all.

Come on, statistically better? are you serious?

Too many variables to judge from statisics alone.

None of this excuses the fact we are hemorrhaging players from an already weaker team, without even replacing them at all, let alone replacing with similiar/better quality players.

Judging by the recruitment so far and the performance this season you can already see a poor season next year a mile off.

He's an average journeyman.

The type of player the wakefields, celtics and quins of this world use to bolster their squad, but the type of player a top team doesn't sign because they just use academy instead.

I can only assume we no longer have aspirations of being the best. We had our 3 titles on the trot and we're getting our new southstand, so let's let's just chill out in mid table in the comfort zone.

Terrence Seu Seu is replacement for Bedsy

Looking forward to tedious arguments about how Seu Seu has a more exotic surname than Diskin.

If Seu Seu is a better player than McShane then great....if not, again, what's the bluddy point ?

Either way it seems McShane will be the first of an exodus of good young ENGLISH forwards (was it that long ago that some of here proclaimed him to be the new K.Cunningham ?). Well done GH.

I suspect Amor and Ambler will follow thanks to the signing of our dynamic new 30 year old prop

and re-signing of another two

.....even better GH

For once I agree, but last weeks League Express suggests McShane is perfectly happy to stay at the club.

It remains to be seen how we use Moore, but while I haven't seen him much this season, the stats at least, and the reviews he has been getting, suggest that Amor has earned a shot next season. Not as sure on Ambler, but I don't believe he's any less a player than Moore.

With Peacock, Leuluai, Kirke, Moore and (unless something changes ) Bailey, its hard to see Amber and Amor coming back - certainly not both of them. Having 7 props in a squad of 25 would be ridiculous.

Mcshane just signed new 4 yr deal so he going no where I was told when Amor went to Wakey they had the option to keep him so cnt see him coming back and just dont think Ambler is good enough

Never heard of Seu Seu but hope that wont stiffle Hoods chances to the point he leaves

As long as we keep McDermott it doesn't matter who we sign or who leaves the club on the playing front. Even if we win the CC he should be replaced.

Agree DHM.

I said the same last week. 100% agree.

I'm still not sold on McDermott and a lot of his tactics and selection policies leave me scratching my head but you cannot sack a coach that wins one of the two major trophies on offer.

Ending the season with a wet sail gives him another year IMO. Perhaps his ideas are now starting to be implemented? I spoke to yet another coach on Saturday who have been to one of his clinics and been very impressed with him.

One thing I will say, he's improved the defence significantly as the season as gone on.

I've heard a few RL professionals saying how impressed they are by him.

But let's get this straight...

Finishing 5th of what Swiftcorn will quite rightly tell you is a 5 team competition, and reaching a Challenge Cup Final in which Castleford were the best team we faced en route (and even then we only managed to scrape it!), coupled with the appalling rugby we've had to watch along the way, is hardly testament to what a quality coach he is. I'd rather see him gone thanks.

On Richard Moore - can you honestly see St Helens, Wigan, Warrington or Huddersfield signing him?

If he is not good enough for them why do some on here think he will a suitable signing for Leeds? are you accepting mediocrity as the norm?

On Seu Seu - he cannot even get a gig in the NRL so again why would Leeds sign him?

I agree with the principle.

That said, there are many players that can't get a gig in the NRL but that can easily cut it over here. Michael Dobson for example?

I'm with G1 on this. McDermott may not be the best coach we've had but if he manages to beat hot-favourites Wigan in the CC then he does deserve another season (unlikely as this may be). He also has to be judged on how Leeds perform in the play-offs - if Leeds demonstrate the ability to beat top 3 opposition (i.e. not Huddersfield or Catalans) then I might reconsider my position depending on the circumstances.

On the signings front, Moore is a disappointment but hopefully players of greater ability will be announced in due course. The logical time would be in the week or so after our almost inevitable cup loss to Wigan

Leeds squad issues this year certainly arent quantity, but quantity. If we lose Ali, Burgess, Cross, Buderus, Senior, and bring in two high quality players and Richard Moore, then I think our squad will be improved.

Im not too bothered if we are losing squad players like Burgess and Cross, and over the past two years Ali. Pitts, Singleton, Clarskon, Singleton, and Ambler can fight for those spots.

Senior needs replacing, as would Buderus if he goes, letting go the likes of Ali, Burgess, Cross etc, allows us to bring in better to fill those two positions.

If anything right now, our squad is too large, im not overly worried about trimming some of the fat.

Dobson is a pretty average half back - look at where Hull KR are in the table - you have to judge his performances against the top 4 not the rest. Good sides have little difficulty in containing him.

I'd go the other way, and say that it's the club he's at. If he were at a bigger club, with a stronger pack etc then I think he'd be up there with the best (in the SL, still not a patch on NRL!).

Look at Rangi Chase too. I'm not saying Dobson/Chase are world class players, I'm just saying, these are players that couldn't succeed in the NRL, yet are "stand out" over here.

The same COULD (<- Key word!!) apply to Seu Seu.

Sal makes some good points but i can see where RR is coming from but for me the 9 should go to Macca and then give the kid the season there.
I can also see what Smokey is saying re-adding quality along with Moore but i still wouldn't of signed Moore or retained Kirke tbh.

This is always a tricky conundrum. Some players make the jump to a top 4 club (which I hope we are aiming to be again in the not-too distant future) well and look like top players there, having done well at a previous club. Others never make the transition well enough and prove more adept at being modestly-large fish in a fairly small and slightly eutrophied pond.

Like you, I suspect Dobson may be the latter to be honest. Hard to be certain without seeing them in the big games.

I have decided this thread is getting too long, so I have summarised the general theme below: