Agree on all counts.

Anybody who thinks Buderus is a 30+ past it and a waste of a shirt isn't watching the same man as me. As you put BB... he is simply class.

Kirke's stats:

23 tackles (+ 1 missed)
12 carries for 93m
Conceded 1 pen

Edit: I take back what I wrote last week about his go forward

Yes. I'd also question bluey's coaching decisions, especially when we had more fit bodies in the second half of the season. His selection was dictated by injuries at times.

I'm sure they did compliment each other. I'm sure they are both fine, upstanding pillars of society. After all that is what a believist supporter like me should think! 

What was the time when Delaney went off?

11 carries for 99 metres @ 9 m/c isnt bad going at all. Plus he'd already made 20 tackles by the time he went off. I think we have found a top 2nd row forward here.

Hall again was solid with 137 metres. Most of these come from driving the ball up to help out the forwards too.

Leuluai and Burgess making 114 & 111 metres each is good to see. And Kirke making 93 (shhh... dont let G1 find out) Shows that we have the forward power to cope without Peacock who did, to be fair, carry our pack for the last 2 years.

Just short of 8 metres per carry then - decent effort, although Hull do need to address their forward pack as a matter of urgency. Too many players who like to do the fancy stuff with ball in hand but aren't keen on putting in the hard work defensively (Manu, Lauaki, Moa),

I'd guess it was about 50 minutes. Not that they are required, because it was clearly evident to the naked eye, but these stats back up what an outstanding shift he put in

I'd guess it was about 50 minutes. Not that they are required, because it was clearly evident to the naked eye, but these stats back up what an outstanding shift he put in

Yeah deffinately. He looked class everytime he got the ball and I had a feeling he would be pushing 100.

Forgive me, given the precise context of the quote 'average antipodean' I think I may be overstating Donald's ability. I would equally describe Delaney (at centre) in those same terms incidentally.

They add little to SL, they block opportunities for rising Academy players, they hold this game back.

Is it any wonder Britain struggles on the International stage (especially in the backs) when these types are recruited.

Buderus on the other hand I have no issue with, even at his advanced age. All quality, an inspirational player.

Did anybody else notice the size of Delaney's head when Sky show the team formation at the start of the match??

I think that alone should act as sufficient proof he should be in the pack!

Delaney is a player you craved, bemoaning Leeds inability to scour the NRL for a right centre during the 2009 season, expressing your unhappiness with Academy products Lee Smith, Carl Ablett and Ashley Gibson for the right centre jersey.

Which rising young Academy prospect would have had their career enhanced had the club signed Sam Moa, another signing you praised Hull for making and berated Leeds for not so doing?

How does Buderus playing 80 minutes help Diskin, McShane or Hood?

Let's not try and dress it up TVOC. Your view has nothing to do with "adding to SL" or "blocking Academy players". If they're foreign, they're OK do as long as YOU rate them. If not, it's damaging to the game presumably?

For me, (i.e. if I were the 'YOU' mentioned) that statement can be applied to all players, from all countries, of all ages, in all leagues.

HTH

Why should it?! Where does it say that it has to?!

It's not Buderus' fault he's a class above. 'Leeds Rhinos' sole purpose of existence is to get bums on seats to pay wages and make it's owners money. That's it. Full stop.

A bi-product of that is winning trophies (which in turn gets bums on seats, pays wages & makes money), another bi-product of that is entertaining people (which in turn gets bums on seats, pays wages & makes money).

If McShane was better than Buderus, it would be noticed. He'd be utterly dominating the U20's week in, week out, and thus earn a bench spot. He would then outshine Buderus when his bench spot turned to a stint on the field, he would then earn a starting spot.


If you were having a conservatory built, you wouldn't give two shiny sh*ts as to whether the senior, master craftsman of a builder spent enough time 'helping' the young apprentice builder to make sure he was good enough to build conservatories in the future. You'd want the best builder, building your conservatory right there and then. End of story.

You better ask TVOC. That is what he said.

You called Donald "a =#4000FFdecidedly average antipodean"

This is the winger that finished 2nd in the Superleague try scorers list in 2008 and has scored some memorable and outstanding tries! certainly not "a decidedly average antipodean"

You seem to have forgotten that when Donald was signed we did not have the luxury of any rising Academy wingers. Hall was not ready then.

What you also seem to have forgotten is that in the season after he was the 2nd top try scorer in Superleague he was switched from the left to the right side which not only broke up the successful partnership with Senior but gave him a succession of bit player centres including 2nd row forwards which certainly effected his scoring opportunities. Until then he had scored 53 tries in 79 games. He also suffered injuries in 2009 and 10

Once Hall had moved to the left with Senior he began to flourish so Donald was not blocking his opportunities!

With regard to Delaney at centre I fully agree and said so on several occasions last season and also had said he could make a good 2nd rower in the McKenna mould.

I am all for giving youngsters their chance, but this is professional sport and if the Academy lads are not ready you have to sign the best available for that position and Donald was the man at the time.



Here I agree with you 100%

Nor will I or Jones-Bishop's perfectly weighted and executed double kick through and chase in Cardiff last week.

My point always was and always will be, why have we had to wait for the 'average antipodean' to finally renege on a contract before releasing the potential of our own Leeds produced, future potential England prospects.

It's important also to remember at the end of last season Donald and coach McClennan were still scheduled to be here in 2011, potentially further limiting those opportunities.

No doubt if Jones-Bishop in that scenario was sent away to learn for yet another year the faithfully would be hailing that decision also.

I thought his contract was terminated by mutual consent. If so, your statement above is potentially libellous.

Thank you for the advice, I'll try and bear it in mind in future.

_________



I do so on the basis of what he achieved in the NRL. Do you have a beer mat handy I might need to borrow one, failing that a postage stamp. In addition for several months before he arrived in this country he was playing reserve grade football.



Why have you chosen to wait until Donald's third season to comment on his strike rate. The young Leeds, English ex-Academy winger he replaced (according to the club CEO and who am I to argue) was the top try scorer in SL in his final season at Leeds. Had a much higher work rate and the best chase game in SL, something Donald was never interested in replicating, too much effort needed. As you mention scoring tries (which I agree is an important aspect of a winger's role) Donald's was 63 per 100 Appearances for Leeds, the player he replaced was 74, so I'm glad you've considered this.



Leeds wouldn't have needed one had they looked after the player they had invested time and money in already who was by now the finished article producing the goods week in week out. Next in line? Try Peter Fox, you may recall Leeds had him out at loan at York in 2006 but perhaps not as it's only me that conveniently forgets these things according to some. Never given the opportunity at Headingley but who went on to gain International honours while playing elsewhere shortly after by the same coach who had shown him the door. Ooops. Terrrrrrrific, the more expensive, quota taking, half-hearted, pension topping upping Scott Donald by plenty again. You really must remind me why England struggle at International level again sometime and why 'average antipodeans' are not part of the problem or like many club supporters do you not care.

Don't misunderstand me .... I am in total agreement with you. If young capable home grown talent is blocked by antipodean imports that offer no more... then it is indeed a travesty. We are lucky BJB is still with the club despite now being 22 ... And like you I think the loss of Broughton was a severe case of mis - management.

I have questioned the wisdom of persisting with the two-hooker farce; the signing of Delaney as a centre when BJB would have been at least as capable in that role; and the signing of Cross at Ambler's expense

It is ironic that the one exceptional recent antipodean talent that could have been justified was diminished by more mis-management in appeasing his nemesis. However, as I have also previously stated, even that signing should not stand in the way of an exceptional or equal home grown talent: if Liam Hood meets that criteria ( Diskin didn't ) he should be the club's priority. No more mistakes ...

My only issue was use of the word 'average' for Donald...guess it depends on your definition... BUT again I emphasise Broughton would have been the better signing of the two.

Fox was given chances in pre-season friendlies and deemed surplus by TS a coach who had won a championship and WCC so i've no problem with that tbh but good on Fox for working hard in the lower leagues and eventually earning a chance at Wakey and then HKR.
Now Calderwood wanted more than the club offered simple so who says they then went and spent MORE on Donald?
Donald already had a decent NRL strike-rate btw and as we all saw maybe Calderwood was'nt "all that" and he (like others have since) benefited from playing in a quality team.

Well lets look at what he achieved in the NRL.

For Manly he scored 48 tries in 68 games
For Paramatta he scored 15 tries in 21 games

I would say this is an above average performance in the NRL




Why do you not accept that this is an above average performance_

OK if you need more.
In 2006 he was the 3rd top try scoring winger in Superleague.
In both 2007 and 2008 he was named in the Superleague Dream Team

Again hardly a record of "a decidedly average antipodean" I am so glad your views are not considered by the Leeds management.



This same player was too greedy in his contract renewal negotiations. I note you have not recorded his tries per 100 games since he left Leeds.

Compare Donalds record against Calderwoods over the same period then try telling us that Leeds made the wrong decision.





oooh you are an angry chappie. I think you are losing it tvoc.

...and how well would Broughton go in a " quality team "...? Considering how good he has looked playing for lowly Salford.

I would suggest he is a better specialist wing talent than either Calderwood, Fox or, especially, Smith. ( much though I like him )

Broughton spent time on loan at Hull mate and the powers that be decided against giving him the deal he wanted or did'nt offer one at all and judging by how our squad looked at the start of last year again i'm fine with that.
lets get one thing straight we have'nt let the next "Jason Robinson" get away and good luck to the kid and although he got selected for the train on squad i take that with a pinch of salt given tyhat it was Mcbanana who picked him.
Btw Gibson has looked more than adequate in the Salford team a player i backed on here for yrs just for many to deem him not good enough but like as has been suggested many times you can't keep them all and but for a horrendous injury list and poor CC final last year the Bjb loan or Broughton release would'nt of been mentioned half as much.
Smith isn't just a winger he's a quality outside back that can perform at a very good level in a number of positions and i certainly would'nt swop him for Broughton or any of the other players mentioned.

Then you are far too easily pleased when recruiting what should be a limited resource. At almost 26 above average would be City V Country selection, State Of Origin Squad Selection, Australian Squad selection, Rothmans medal selection etc and certainly not reserve grade selection.




Wow amazing. The player he replaced was the top try scorer (as well as top winger) in SL.



And the other wingers were: in 2007 Kevin Penny and 2008 Ade Gardner. I guess these players must also be considered above average now then.



Quite true because if they did we'd have lost the services of Worrall, Gibson and Bush. Oh hang on a minute.



Feel free to do so. It'll be higher than Donald will achieve.



The comparison I'm interested in, is did the potency and involvement from the right wing position improve with the change in personel from 2005 to 2006. IMO (take it or leave it) it regressed and markedly so.



You said it.

And if say Calderwood wanted £5K more then Leeds were offering they would still be right in digging their heels in and showing him the door, yes?

Brad Godden left the club alledgedly for such a piffling difference in valuation.

I can imagine what you were thinking about Godden at the time, **** him, am I right, I'm not wrong am I.



Followed immediately by desperately getting the shot to pieces Leeds defence into some sort of order. Screaming at Smith where he wanted him.

Nice to see someone who takes a pride in their performance and clearly cares about the club getting his chance .... finally.

Mark Calderwood justified a pay rise after become a great all round player by his final season for Leeds. However there’s the salary cap to consider and the fact that one person doesn’t make up a whole team. If money wasn’t an issue, we’d probably have all the better Leeds born players playing for the Rhinos today. However we have to make do with what the rules are.

In no way should the above be used to demonise Scott Donald or Gary Hetherington for that matter. If anything the RFL should be cursed.