WHAT!

Donald was an outstanding performer for Leeds over many seasons. He suffered only one dip in form (last season) but returned to form at the end.

He always gave his full effort and the try he scored in the GF, when he turned Wellens inside out, was of the very highest order. He possessed all the attributes that made him one of the very best wingers around - speed, swerve, good hands, good defence, good finisher and courage.

If he is average then who is outstanding?

It's the unquestioning faith of people that allows their minds to be easily manipulated by their " superiors " ! !

Surely the job of a head coach is to choose his team on merit and not a misguided sense of loyalty to any individual whatever his perceived status at the club ! Buderus or Diskin should have been given the full match for the greater good of the team. Does that answer your question ?

By the way Buderus and Diskin certainly did not complement each other.... But how do you know they did not compliment each other ?

Top 3 (in no order)

1) Buderus.

He is an 80 minute hooker. He can't "sparkle" for the whole 80 minutes and shouldn't be expected to do so.

People around me were complaining because he wasn't in at dummy half for every single play-the-ball with tosh like "See!! Burrow had to go in again, what's the point Buderus being on the pitch!" and equally ridiculously stupid comments. I bit my tongue. If there's a break on, what's the point in waiting for Buderus to get there!? Makes no sense. There was a game against Wigan (??? citation needed) in which JJB was named at hooker and over the match there was 7/8/9/10 different people in at dummy half and we played all the better for it. If Buderus needs a 10 minute spell without running to every tackle that's fine with me. At least he's on the pitch should a break happen or an opportunity arise. His defensive awareness and tackling ability is one of (if not the) most superior in our whole team.

2) Burrow.

Good to see him playing like that again. There was a period of the game in which Sinnie had a niggling injury and Burrow's general kicking game was outstanding. The first two matches of this season Robbie has looked how I was expecting him to look to the first few games of last season (with a full preseason etc). He looks sharp, a threat, and unpredictable, which is something he hasn't looked for 2 or 3 seasons.

3) Delaney

He said on his twitter he was enjoying playing in the pack. I hope that's genuinely the case because he has the potential to be one of the stand out second rowers in SL (injuries permitting) and he certainly has no chance of being a stand out centre.


Think that's my top three but it feels harsh because the whole 17 were outstanding. Under those circumstances, with those injuries I thought we couldn't have asked for more. (The two O'Meely tries we a bit soft but it was never going to be a 'perfect' performance so if that's what we needed to concede on then so be it).

Although I whole-heartedly agree with TVOC on the Broughton saga ... And I do believe Donald was only " going through the motions " in his last season, I do think he was much better than average for a good few years. Some of his tries scored were scintillating wingers' tries... . And who will ever forget Mcguire's try against Catalans in the GF match at Headingley which resulted from his imperious pin-point kick in field at full speed ? Majestic memories.

Absolutely ! On ALL counts. Well said that man.

Up until leaving the field, Delaney was the stand out performer for Leeds IMO.

Good yards after contact, always winning the collision and generating a quick play the ball. Defending closer to the middle where players are more likely to try and run at you rather than around you suits his tackling style - he's much more effective hitting front on rather than side on.

What stands out for me with Buderus is his decision making, which is ahead of every other hooker in SL in my opinion. Very rarely takes the wrong option, reserves his scoots from acting half for when it's truly on and is quick to read what's happening in front of him.

Another tidy 80 minutes from Jones-Bishop too. Often with inexperienced players you're going to get mistakes to go along with moments of quality, particularly when they are in exposed positions like wing or full back. He's an instinctive runner with ball in hand but his effort to get back and bring down Tom Briscoe having packed at loose forward was the highlight play of the night for mine. May want to spend a little time in training working on getting underneath ball carriers close to the line though.

Little mention as well for the much maligned Ian Kirke. Not sure what the stats are going to show but I thought second half in particular he put his hand up on both sides of the game - carried well and defendly solidly, a couple of shuddering efforts on Craig Fitzgibbon in particular.

Leeds against Hull:

Brent Webb-Looked good again, linked well before injury.

Ben Jones-Bishop-Takes his chances! Great run on-to the King Kev flick. Reads the game ever so well. Looks the part.

Ryan Hall-Solid as always. His positioning seems a bit more clued up, but he hasn't been tested much in this area much yet.

Keith Senior-Ran strong, had a field day against Long.

Kallum Watkins-Saw another depth to him. Didn't get a great amount of space to weave his magic, but he was more than willing to cart the ball up, which is good to see.

Brett Delaney-Delaney looking effective in second row? Who would have suggested that? Me! Had his most effective game IMO, just one sloppy spill of the ball. But worked hard and looked to be enjoying himself before the injury.

Rob Burrow-Has come back to life, running at the line more, great distribution. Good kicking game again.

Kevin Sinfield-Kept the flow of what Leeds did well. And what about 'that flick'? A monumental level of skill - just deviated the ball to BJB. Sheer class. Always looked for an attacking option.

Jamie Jones-Buchanan-Great start to the season. Great tempo of charges, needs to make sure he's hitting the straps down the flanks though, but looks for work, which is great.

Carl Ablett-Had more of an impact than last week, shame about the knock.

Danny Buderus-Class. Knows when to run, knows when to wait. Another fine contribution.

Kylie Leuluai-Some huge hits, improved on last weeks game. Good impact considering he was on extended game time.

Luke Burgess-Another poweful performance. His first stint caught my eye.

Lee Smith-Shows the depth we have even with injuries, you can bring on Lee Smith. Webb's injury could have foxed some teams but the re-jig with BJB and Smith worked a treat. Smith didn't let anyone down.

Chris Clarkson-Sniffs stuff out and was solid.

Ian Kirke-Seemed to take the ball up a little more than usual but was dealt with quite easily.

Weller Hauraki-Nice debut score, nice to seem him get a run out and get to grips with our plays etc. Will give us plenty of options as the season moves on.

As for Hull - we dealt with their pack easily again. Whiting put a shift in, great determination in sticking BJB in the corner rather than the easy score under the sticks. Also saved a few trys. Long was awful, he didn't want to defend that right flank, was to blame for a few scores for failing to look to tackle or tracking back. He used to dictate a game, a spent force it looks like.

Agree on all counts.

Anybody who thinks Buderus is a 30+ past it and a waste of a shirt isn't watching the same man as me. As you put BB... he is simply class.

Kirke's stats:

23 tackles (+ 1 missed)
12 carries for 93m
Conceded 1 pen

Edit: I take back what I wrote last week about his go forward

Yes. I'd also question bluey's coaching decisions, especially when we had more fit bodies in the second half of the season. His selection was dictated by injuries at times.

I'm sure they did compliment each other. I'm sure they are both fine, upstanding pillars of society. After all that is what a believist supporter like me should think! 

What was the time when Delaney went off?

11 carries for 99 metres @ 9 m/c isnt bad going at all. Plus he'd already made 20 tackles by the time he went off. I think we have found a top 2nd row forward here.

Hall again was solid with 137 metres. Most of these come from driving the ball up to help out the forwards too.

Leuluai and Burgess making 114 & 111 metres each is good to see. And Kirke making 93 (shhh... dont let G1 find out) Shows that we have the forward power to cope without Peacock who did, to be fair, carry our pack for the last 2 years.

Just short of 8 metres per carry then - decent effort, although Hull do need to address their forward pack as a matter of urgency. Too many players who like to do the fancy stuff with ball in hand but aren't keen on putting in the hard work defensively (Manu, Lauaki, Moa),

I'd guess it was about 50 minutes. Not that they are required, because it was clearly evident to the naked eye, but these stats back up what an outstanding shift he put in

I'd guess it was about 50 minutes. Not that they are required, because it was clearly evident to the naked eye, but these stats back up what an outstanding shift he put in

Yeah deffinately. He looked class everytime he got the ball and I had a feeling he would be pushing 100.

Forgive me, given the precise context of the quote 'average antipodean' I think I may be overstating Donald's ability. I would equally describe Delaney (at centre) in those same terms incidentally.

They add little to SL, they block opportunities for rising Academy players, they hold this game back.

Is it any wonder Britain struggles on the International stage (especially in the backs) when these types are recruited.

Buderus on the other hand I have no issue with, even at his advanced age. All quality, an inspirational player.

Did anybody else notice the size of Delaney's head when Sky show the team formation at the start of the match??

I think that alone should act as sufficient proof he should be in the pack!

Delaney is a player you craved, bemoaning Leeds inability to scour the NRL for a right centre during the 2009 season, expressing your unhappiness with Academy products Lee Smith, Carl Ablett and Ashley Gibson for the right centre jersey.

Which rising young Academy prospect would have had their career enhanced had the club signed Sam Moa, another signing you praised Hull for making and berated Leeds for not so doing?

How does Buderus playing 80 minutes help Diskin, McShane or Hood?

Let's not try and dress it up TVOC. Your view has nothing to do with "adding to SL" or "blocking Academy players". If they're foreign, they're OK do as long as YOU rate them. If not, it's damaging to the game presumably?

For me, (i.e. if I were the 'YOU' mentioned) that statement can be applied to all players, from all countries, of all ages, in all leagues.

HTH

Why should it?! Where does it say that it has to?!

It's not Buderus' fault he's a class above. 'Leeds Rhinos' sole purpose of existence is to get bums on seats to pay wages and make it's owners money. That's it. Full stop.

A bi-product of that is winning trophies (which in turn gets bums on seats, pays wages & makes money), another bi-product of that is entertaining people (which in turn gets bums on seats, pays wages & makes money).

If McShane was better than Buderus, it would be noticed. He'd be utterly dominating the U20's week in, week out, and thus earn a bench spot. He would then outshine Buderus when his bench spot turned to a stint on the field, he would then earn a starting spot.


If you were having a conservatory built, you wouldn't give two shiny sh*ts as to whether the senior, master craftsman of a builder spent enough time 'helping' the young apprentice builder to make sure he was good enough to build conservatories in the future. You'd want the best builder, building your conservatory right there and then. End of story.

You better ask TVOC. That is what he said.

You called Donald "a =#4000FFdecidedly average antipodean"

This is the winger that finished 2nd in the Superleague try scorers list in 2008 and has scored some memorable and outstanding tries! certainly not "a decidedly average antipodean"

You seem to have forgotten that when Donald was signed we did not have the luxury of any rising Academy wingers. Hall was not ready then.

What you also seem to have forgotten is that in the season after he was the 2nd top try scorer in Superleague he was switched from the left to the right side which not only broke up the successful partnership with Senior but gave him a succession of bit player centres including 2nd row forwards which certainly effected his scoring opportunities. Until then he had scored 53 tries in 79 games. He also suffered injuries in 2009 and 10

Once Hall had moved to the left with Senior he began to flourish so Donald was not blocking his opportunities!

With regard to Delaney at centre I fully agree and said so on several occasions last season and also had said he could make a good 2nd rower in the McKenna mould.

I am all for giving youngsters their chance, but this is professional sport and if the Academy lads are not ready you have to sign the best available for that position and Donald was the man at the time.



Here I agree with you 100%

Nor will I or Jones-Bishop's perfectly weighted and executed double kick through and chase in Cardiff last week.

My point always was and always will be, why have we had to wait for the 'average antipodean' to finally renege on a contract before releasing the potential of our own Leeds produced, future potential England prospects.

It's important also to remember at the end of last season Donald and coach McClennan were still scheduled to be here in 2011, potentially further limiting those opportunities.

No doubt if Jones-Bishop in that scenario was sent away to learn for yet another year the faithfully would be hailing that decision also.

I thought his contract was terminated by mutual consent. If so, your statement above is potentially libellous.

Thank you for the advice, I'll try and bear it in mind in future.

_________



I do so on the basis of what he achieved in the NRL. Do you have a beer mat handy I might need to borrow one, failing that a postage stamp. In addition for several months before he arrived in this country he was playing reserve grade football.



Why have you chosen to wait until Donald's third season to comment on his strike rate. The young Leeds, English ex-Academy winger he replaced (according to the club CEO and who am I to argue) was the top try scorer in SL in his final season at Leeds. Had a much higher work rate and the best chase game in SL, something Donald was never interested in replicating, too much effort needed. As you mention scoring tries (which I agree is an important aspect of a winger's role) Donald's was 63 per 100 Appearances for Leeds, the player he replaced was 74, so I'm glad you've considered this.



Leeds wouldn't have needed one had they looked after the player they had invested time and money in already who was by now the finished article producing the goods week in week out. Next in line? Try Peter Fox, you may recall Leeds had him out at loan at York in 2006 but perhaps not as it's only me that conveniently forgets these things according to some. Never given the opportunity at Headingley but who went on to gain International honours while playing elsewhere shortly after by the same coach who had shown him the door. Ooops. Terrrrrrrific, the more expensive, quota taking, half-hearted, pension topping upping Scott Donald by plenty again. You really must remind me why England struggle at International level again sometime and why 'average antipodeans' are not part of the problem or like many club supporters do you not care.