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| TBH I just thought he was working on his break dancing skills
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| IMO kicking out in the tackle should be clamped down in the same way as kickers being hit late. Automatic sin-binning for anyone kicking out in the tackle.
But you can't suddenly impose that on a Monday after letting it go on for so long.
The fact is that if there had been no contact it would have been play on. That has to stop. If a player kicks out then he should be instantly penalised, because the incident yesterday highlighted how dangerous it is. If a player kicks out in future and makes contact with someone they should be sin-binned or sent off.
But you don't do that by suddenly coming up with a punishment on Monday that didn't exist at the weekend.
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| The Senior incident was more to do with how high he kicked out. No way was that accidental.
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"The Senior incident was more to do with how high he kicked out. No way was that accidental.'"
I think the accidental term is being used to say he wasn't aiming to kick Tompkins, which from where he was and with a man over his torso / head is correct, but waving your legs around like that is always likely to result in someone getting a boot.
Tompkins could have lost an eye if he'd been unlucky, so the RFL should look at stamping it out
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| Quote ="Lord God Jose Mourinho"If a player kicks out then he should be instantly penalised, because the incident yesterday highlighted how dangerous it is. If a player kicks out in future and makes contact with someone they should be sin-binned or sent off. '"
The punishment should not be different depending on damage or injuries casued for any offence or rule broken
in the stands i didnt think it should have been a penalty, as it is very common for players to jump and swing their bodies to get up but Senior's kick was excessive and a penalty was deserved
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| Quote ="Hopie"The punishment should not be different depending on damage or injuries casued for any offence or rule broken
in the stands i didnt think it should have been a penalty, as it is very common for players to jump and swing their bodies to get up but Senior's kick was excessive and a penalty was deserved'"
Punishments should not be related to the injury, but if the RFL look at the area, they need to see what happened to Tompkins, what could have happened if a stuf had hit him an inch lower.
Like a spear tackle, the punishment should reflect the potential damage, and the fact that it is not something we wnat in the game
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| Keith used the same action I use to get myself up when lying on the couch. Put it down to advancing years!
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| Quote ="tad rhino"you were lucky it wasn't a ref with with balls or you would never have had 13 on the pitch. consistent dissent and laying on in the tackle.
also watch the game again. wigan sometimes had 3 dummy runners that all stopped right in the defensive line, which led to the ball carrier going through a gap caused by an obstruction'"
Quite right. Wigan have been getting away with this sort of deliberate obstruction all season and they have a planned move for Tomkins to run from close to the ruck behind one or other of this "blanket obstruction screen"
With regard to the Farrell incident, it wasn't a tackle anyway. He did not use his arms or hands at all, but just dropped his shoulder while Maguire was in the air. Whether committed or not this is a clear yellow card.
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| Quote ="jonh"When Farrell committed to the tackle McGuire still had the ball, hence it was not a penalty,'"
What Farrell did was not "commit to a tackle". Unless your players tackle by jumping into the air, feet first towards the attacker. As was said on the TV he simply jumped dangerously and late at the kicker. His arms weren't engaged in either attempting to tackle or block the kick. The decision was spot on as were most during an intense, very hard fought and entertaining tie.
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| Oscar for maguire plus best recovery performance 2010
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| Just watched the game again and how anyone can say Seniors kick was intentially aimed at Tomkins is a joke.
His face was covered by the Wigan tackler .
Senior was kicking his legs up to emphasise how long Wigan were lying on in the tackle.
Definite penalty but no sin binning .
No mention by the way of Sam Tomkins jumping up, moving his arm and moving off the mark every time Sinfield takes a penalty kick.
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| What a bitter one eyed thread
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| Quote ="G1"What Farrell did was not "commit to a tackle". Unless your players tackle by jumping into the air, feet first towards the attacker. As was said on the TV he simply jumped dangerously and late at the kicker. His arms weren't engaged in either attempting to tackle or block the kick. The decision was spot on as were most during an intense, very hard fought and entertaining tie.'"
As was said by John Kear who nearly creamed himself over Leeds all game. Tomkins went in to pressure the kicker make the charge down, he was in the air when the kick was made he may be a good young player but he cannot defy the laws of gravity.
Rugby League players have to be fully committed and Farrell went in at 100 %, he was not late, it was a shocking call. I understand we have to protect the kicker but they cannot have total protection if they did Leeds do not win the game.
If we are going off "what they said on tv" by the way, Jonathan Davies who was a kicker and regularly put in that position said it was a poor call and not a penalty.
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| Quote ="chapylad"Just watched the game again and how anyone can say Seniors kick was intentially aimed at Tomkins is a joke.
His face was covered by the Wigan tackler .
Senior was kicking his legs up to emphasise how long Wigan were lying on in the tackle.
Definite penalty but no sin binning .
No mention by the way of Sam Tomkins jumping up, moving his arm and moving off the mark every time Sinfield takes a penalty kick.'"
Senior put himself and his feet in a position to be penalised, there is kicking out and then there is throwing your legs into a position that can cause injury.
I agree by the way it was handled correctly, but i think Keith will be receiving a letter from the RFL asking him to be mindful of kicking out in such a way in future.
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| Quote ="jonh"As was said by John Kear who nearly creamed himself over Leeds all game. Tomkins went in to pressure the kicker make the charge down, he was in the air when the kick was made he may be a good young player but he cannot defy the laws of gravity.
Rugby League players have to be fully committed and Farrell went in at 100 %, he was not late, it was a shocking call. I understand we have to protect the kicker but they cannot have total protection if they did Leeds do not win the game.
If we are going off "what they said on tv" by the way, Jonathan Davies who was a kicker and regularly put in that position said it was a poor call and not a penalty.'"
If this had been TMFMISL on precious Sam there would be mass outcry. It was an illegal late challenge on the kicker, one that is penalised by 10 mins.
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| It can only be late if the player is not committed and has the ability to pull out of the challenge. I have no problem with the hits on Tomkins all day, but the ref got this call wrong and it was not helped by the McGuire milking of the situation.
No problem with the result and not claiming the ref lost us the game, attempting to defend such a slender lead cost us the game rather than trying to win it, all I am saying is this was the wrong call.
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| Quote ="jonh"Tomkins went in to pressure the kicker make the charge down, '"
No, he didn't. He lept at McGuire's Torso. No Part of Farrell's body was going anywhere near the ball. The ball will have been on the end of McGuire's foot. Why leap so high into McGuire's mid riff?
The referee got the decision absolutely right, IMO.
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| I thought the ref got most of the calls with respect to foul play about right.
Protection for the kicker has to be a priority. As someone said, the rule is for exactly the same reason as the penalties for spear tackles - to protect players from serious injury.
This argument about being 'committed' and 'unable to stop' is baloney. If you run full pelt at someone who is going to kick the ball and - surprise - they actually do kick it before you get there, then if you hit them you should get penalised. If you're not even looking at the kicker whilst running at them, then you're patently not interested in stopping the ball.
Players who manage to get at a kicker with a semblance of control about what they're doing should be rewarded, not big lumps who are patently out to bash a kicker regardless of whether they have the ball or not. If that means most attempts to get at a kicker are farily lame, then sobeit but I think the rules are about right and most players seem to understand how it works.
As for kicking out at the tackle, I think it should be a sinbinning offence if its deemed to be unnecessary. I can't remember anyone getting a long ban for deliberately kicking out but I know I've seen a few tackles where it does look like there's real intent there.
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| Quote ="jonh"It can only be late if the player is not committed and has the ability to pull out of the challenge.'"
Total b0ll0cks. So much so that I can't be ar$ed spelling it out. But just think for one moment how ridiculous this statement is.
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| Quote ="jonh"It can only be late if the player is not committed and has the ability to pull out of the challenge. I have no problem with the hits on Tomkins all day, but the ref got this call wrong and it was not helped by the McGuire milking of the situation.
No problem with the result and not claiming the ref lost us the game, attempting to defend such a slender lead cost us the game rather than trying to win it, all I am saying is this was the wrong call.'"
I love the "milking it" bit, he was hit in mid air side on with no protection and hit the ground hard so he was bound to be in the least winded!
As for milking situations i've never seen so many drama queens on a rugby pitch after Tompkins got a high slap off Peacock.
Richards,Bailey and co resembled the italian football team running in waving imaginary cards and faux shock and dismay!
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| Quote ="rhinoms"I love the "milking it" bit, he was hit in mid air side on with no protection and hit the ground hard so he was bound to be in the least winded!
As for milking situations i've never seen so many drama queens on a rugby pitch after Tompkins got a high slap off Peacock.
Richards,Bailey and co resembled the italian football team running in waving imaginary cards and faux shock and dismay!
'"
This thread is clearly descending into a yours vs ours he did this your player did that farce.
My point of view on the Farrell incident that he was jumping as an attempt to charge down the kick. He was in the air prior to McGuire kicking it.
If a player is committed to the challenge prior to the ball leaving the attacking player then it cannot be a late hit.
Regards the ref, cannot disagree with many of his other calls on the major incidents Coley spear penalty, no problem, Senior lashing out with the foot dealt with in the correct way, Peacock simply got stepped and threw out a lazy arm, penalty no problem.
The ref did not influence the result, poor tactics from Wigan lost us the game, attempting to defend such a short lead rather than going out to try to win the game was suicidal and ultimately cost us the game not the ref.
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| Quote ="jonh"This thread is clearly descending into a yours vs ours he did this your player did that farce.
My point of view on the Farrell incident that he was jumping as an attempt to charge down the kick. He was in the air prior to McGuire kicking it.
If a player is committed to the challenge prior to the ball leaving the attacking player then it cannot be a late hit.
Regards the ref, cannot disagree with many of his other calls on the major incidents Coley spear penalty, no problem, Senior lashing out with the foot dealt with in the correct way, Peacock simply got stepped and threw out a lazy arm, penalty no problem.
The ref did not influence the result, poor tactics from Wigan lost us the game, attempting to defend such a short lead rather than going out to try to win the game was suicidal and ultimately cost us the game not the ref.'"
It's turning into such a farce because you and other Pie fans are making out Mcguire milked the penalty which he clearly didn't,he was taken out mid air and hit the deck with some impact end of story.
You state he was committed to the challenge and couldn't pull out this is where you've got it wrong he can't just charge into the kicker side on whilst both are in mid air full stop and he made no attempt to charge the ball hence the penalty and sin bin.
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| Quote ="rhinoms"It's turning into such a farce because you and other Pie fans are making out Mcguire milked the penalty which he clearly didn't,he was taken out mid air and hit the deck with some impact end of story.
You state he was committed to the challenge and couldn't pull out this is where you've got it wrong he can't just charge into the kicker side on whilst both are in mid air full stop and he made no attempt to charge the ball hence the penalty and sin bin.'"
We will have to agree to disagree on this one.
As for McGuire milking it, well put it this way if he was as badly hurt as he initially looked, he made a fast recovery one the penalty was awarded.
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| he didn't have to be badly hurt. he was caught late and that it is a mandatory yellow. if he was trying to block the kick then fine but he wasn't. he simply jumped into the kicker
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| I thought a lot of Wigan players were good at accidentally tripping up, so that they could play the ball off the mark. Sam Tomkins had it down to a t!
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