Aye.

Perhaps if Wigan hadn't agreed to them, they'd have been lower.

I would have to agree, the cup was always the big comp for the first half of the year with the first game of the season being a cup game and rounds coming thick and fast it kept it in the spotlight, not sure why they had to change it.

IIRC crowds were on the slide before the CC was moved to August.
I seem to remember 25,000 plus for a CC game against Widnes in the 80's. It seemed to be the premier comp even though it only consisted of a few rounds compared to the League season. That appeared to change around the time Sky or BSB as it was, began showing live league games and SL was developed. This has been built up by Sky and SL into the main competition of the season ( and rightly so IMO)and the CC has suffered as a result.

Who do you presume your view is representing when you speak of 'we' above?

The club, the owner, the CEO, the coaches, the players, the support staff, the admin staff, the supporters as one voice or a minority section of supporters.

The Challenge Cup and the Grand Final are two major events in their own right. Teams don't get to choose which won they win, they compete for both.

The fans as a collective or as an individual have no say in the matter.

You do know that Leeds went full time pro before Wigan don't you, or has your primary school teacher not got to that part of your history lesson yet?

Maybe it seemed to be the premier comp because it was the only one of the two big trophies we had a dream of a chance of winning. The biggest games in terms of attendance and atmosphere involving Leeds I remember from the mid 80s were a series of cupties against Widnes and the Elland Road semi vs. Hull KR. If we got knocked out, our chances of success for the season were over. It was a thrill just to get to Wembley to take our beatings against Wigan because it was the nearest to success supporters saw in those days. Now Leeds have success in the League, the cup seems less important (and has seemed more important to Wigan, ha).

That's pretty Leeds-specific though, and otherwise the cup has lost some lustre thanks partly to crazy scheduling. An early-season competition would make more sense, with the last 32 in March, 16 and 8 in April, a double-header semi-final on what was "Magic" weekend and the final round about now. And then we can get on with the second half of the League.

For me, a lot of the cc's decline is down to the increased number of season ticket holders who've effectively paid to watch all the league games in advance. Were all those people to decide whether to attend on a game-to game basis I reckon league crowds would drop considerably too. When there were fewer ST holders, I suspect that many supporters cherry picked the best games and CC matches were part of that decision. Now they're an opt-out for those wanting a weekend off.

It's a fair enough point. It was also the one that ended with a final tie played at Wembley. The league couldn't compete with that with a decider (if a season even needed one) at a packed Naughton Park or other decrepit stadium somewhere oop North. Leeds were never really consistent enough over the course of the season to take out the title of Champions but could raise themselves for a run in the cup comps where they were usually in with half a chance.

A serious run for the Championship seemed like once a decade by comparison.

I agree regarding it was our only chance of winning silverware but i think most fans, regardless of which team they support, gave more importance to the CC. Even Wigan fans who's team dominated the game for so many years appeared to give more prestige to the CC finals they won on the trot than any League titles.

I remember the teams who played in the CC finals from when i started watching the game regularly in the 80's but would struggle to recall who won the League title in those years. Many fans i speak to from the same era have similar thoughts and they are not all Leeds fans.

Thats because the league was a mismatch competition in those days. It was not an even league, as pointed out earlier in this thread. What we have since the advent of super league is far more competitive, and therefore the league is a premier competition to win. The challenge cup doesn't even have as many rounds as it used to have, and therefore with a bit of luck in the draw it is a much easier competition to win.

Therefore with the final of both competitions so close to one another, the premier comp as to take preference.

People also have to remember that prices to watch games these days is much higher than it used to be, and to add to this the financial climate has not been so good for a number of years for some people. Again it then comes down to what takes preference, and to most that would be a Super League game.

Come again?

For those complaining about the cost.

This is Wigans 5th consecutive away game. After Saturday they will have played once at home in the last eight matches.
Now that is expensive.

Without being sanctimonious can you substantiate that?
My recollection is that you were full time pro well before us. I recall a YEP article under Laughton's time where it was mentioned we were going full time to try and catch you up.

Must be nice to get out of Wigan for a few hours mind.

wont it be balanced out earlier/later in the season
its called forward planning

And a full time Leeds still couldn't catch up a part-time Wigan where it mattered.

That was bad.

Oh I agree. But were Wigan Part time?

When wigan went fully pro there was only 1 other fully pro team.

As opposed to the 14 full pro teams we have today.

It's not difficult to grasp then is it, that it's a tougher more level playing field in this era than when wigan were winning lot's of trophies.

I always (rightly or wrongly) associate Leeds' move to being full-time with the departure of John Bentley and Gary Divorty.

That would make Leeds' first full-time season 1992/93

I've no idea when Wigan made the transition.

I wonder if the cars provided to certain players are still provided by Lada

Yeah, I should have worded it clearer.

The top sides do not play as many rounds as they used to is what I meant. There is only 4 games to get to Wembley now, I am sure it used to be more than that.

I thought the number was the same as it's been for years?

It is AFAIK

That isn't what you said though was it?

And It was around the 94 /95 season that Wigan went completely full time, although to be fair that did have a lot of players on full time contracts from around 1990 / 91 but so did may other clubs.

The number of rounds is, but not the round that top clubs join at. We used to join at the same time as the division 2 sides (it was only 2 divisions then), then they made top sides seeded (and there was something else also which I can't remember), then we went to 3 divisions and it changed again.

It might well be the same it's been for years, but that depends how many years you are talking about.