So, Gary H has rightly said that there will be no knee jerk reactions and that the results achieved over the next 4 weeks will put the club in a better position to understand what needs to be done in terms of the team, the coaching staff and the management.

What, in your opinion, would you consider a 'success' given the next 4 games for Leeds and what does failure look like?

The team has got 3 home games that we should win and one tough one away at Wigan. For me, we need to win 3 of the next 4 for it to be considered a success, albeit minor. If we win just 2 games (and it depends which 2!) then heads (team and coaching staff) need to roll.

Success will only come from following our original blueprint for major transition.
I.E. Out with the old in with the new on & off the pitch
Starting this process asap isn't knee jerk nor will 4 more games make it any less inevitable.
Success for me will be seeing a clear plan going forward with fresh faces on/off the pitch & the next batch of jnrs getting regular games & intergrated into becoming 1st team regulars.
Wrt lower league signings or "projects" i have no issue with us taking a gamble on them as long as that isn't the "norm" for our recruitment policy & the 1st 13 at the very least has the required quality.

This.

Anything else is failure.

This.

I don't think too many would expect a new coach to come in, wave his magic wand and turn this current group into championship winners with immediate effect. It's going to take time certainly, but it clearly needs a new regime and ideas and to get that ball rolling now. We can't waste another half season, this one is already a write off imo but valuable rebuilding time could be wasted by letting things just meander on. Glad to hear GH at least now states that things will be done in a few weeks if things don't improve.

This is how I feel, if a new coach is GH's plan then they need to be in charge before the season is out so they have the opportunity to work with the squad and see what is needed over the next couple of years to take us back into the top 4.

We need to start putting in strong performances with a coherent strategy. If we still lose some fair enough. That's sport.
But this drivel served up every week so far..and most of last year has to stop.

Regarding long run success we have to start the rebuild and transition . If we start next season without a new coach and the two or three badly needed replacement of better quality then this year,last year and the next year will all be a waste

As others say above, we need to win 3 out of next 4 minimum, and win well (perform well)and start playing some good rugby and showing an upward trajectory. no blow out losses and competing in every department. if we are still limping along and playing badly then Mcdermott has been given more than enough chances. despite everything on reflection i am happy to stick with Mcdermott if we have a genuine upturn if form and performance. ultimately all i want is for us to be competing at the top end of the table and not being a laughing stock, regardless of who the coach is or the playing roster. hopefully last week was rock bottom ground zero and the only way is up.

Not winning anything is what constitutes success, apparently.

A few years ago I would've said realistically, 1 or 2 of the 3 trophies on offer,

Now I say not getting relegated is success and not ending up in the bottom 4 is like winning league leaders shield

cant win everything every year, and after last year and so far this year competing would be an improvement. realistically if we can turn things around or change things then next year should be pushing for trophys. i see this year as more 2003 and 2006.

The re-build has to start & be good enough to get us even challenging before any thoughts of winning trophies that initself points to success.

I see it as more of a 1996 after Laughton with the old guard like Hanley, Schoey etc.. and a whole host of other names needing moving aside but nothing much in the juniors to take the strain (ok, we are not that bad but you get my drift

) This is not a quick fix thing imo. 2019 at the earliest till we are competing for the trophies again and that is with the right man at the helm, hopefully we get a man in of the ilk of Graham Murray who set us straight after those early dark days of SL.

Does his statement really mean that McDermott will stay because results are not important at the moment. Bring a new coach in and they will want to tinker will all the players leaving and signing a few etc. Saving money for the new stand is all that matters for the next 3 years. After that then we can spend some cash and start competing again. Or am i being overly cynical or talking utter bull ***t. Not sure.

Which new stand?

North or South?

Depends on the context - I am sure for the likes of Wakefield, Salford, Widnes etc just remaining in SL constitutes success.

That's where Leeds were last season after 23 rounds.

Much thanks to the success of Segeyaro who slotted in and did the required business.

And then he saw the light and went AWOL

I'd hope that as a club the era of accepting medicocrity was over. Whilst we might not actually win a trophy, that should be the genuine objective every season. The fact that after 2015 we had to suffer one of the worst seasons in the club's history ought to have shaken the place to its core. That we're now seemingly meandering to a point where keeping our heads in the top 8 is seen as a success really is poor. Last season could have been seen as an understandable blip - instead it seems to have set the new tone.

It will be interesting on here if we do win the next 4 games (big if I know) 6 from 8 would be a decent start to the season.

I think the whole league has changed and not particularly for the better, it does seem that the current system has dumbed the league down rather than raised the standards across the board.

Personally I'm 50/50 on the current Leeds situation I'm doing a GH and teserving judgement until ive seen a few more games.

I was joking, in response to a rather silly post by Gotcha. But the rebuilding has already begun hasn't it? How many young players do we have out on dual-reg or starting to get regular bench time and if the rumours are true then Leeds are very much in the chase to sign Widdop, which is exactly what we need. I can see at least one new forward coming in too, maybe more. We might be a year behind where we should be and heads may roll as a result but it does at least look like we're now in full on transition mode.

I really wish I could share your optimism.

Its funny that you are joking when someone pulls you up - second time in a week!!

Leeds have always had a host of youngsters out on loan - the majority of which are simply not good enough for SL. As we saw on Thursday the depth of the squad is simply not of sufficient quality to challenge the better sides in SL.

Signings in the off season would suggest transition is the last thing on the club's mind - saving money seems the top priority. No changes in the coaching/conditioning set up suggests the bosses are happy with the status quo. I simply don't get where you see full on transition. The Widdop rumour is like the Segayro rumour on a settlement just a rumour. If you were Widdop why would you come to Leeds over say Wigan with a proven pipeline of high quality youngsters coming through?

Maybe Leeds simply can’t afford to compete at the top while the ground needs money spending on it. Perhaps there will be some years of bottom 4 finishes and scraping into 8th place until the major bits of expenditure are out of the way?

The parallels with 95-97 are clear. An old guard of professionals on big money that are growing old together and a new generation coming in that aren’t ready and in some cases haven’t even been identified.

The need for a Murray type coach to come in may help matters but he was helped by the signings of the likes of Harris, Glanville and Godden. Would Hetherington willingly make signings of that expense now? A change of coach might help for a brief period but ideally you need the young players of quality to come in and be performing – rather like from 2002 onwards.

Leeds still have some excellent players but many of these have underperformed for well over a season – they also have some that are past it and some that are obviously not good enough. As an outsider looking in it looks as if the cap has been poorly managed with a lot of money tied up in players who’ve lost their enthusiasm and are going through the motions.

And here we go again.



But what an odd comment

Did the addition of "apparently" to my post not give away the fact I was taking the mick out of something or someone?
And what was the other joke or sarcastic comment you didn't get? Let me know and I'll gladly explain it to you Sal, I'm always happy to help the aged.



The majority will end up elsewhere, no doubt, but some will go on to be first team regulars. Just like happens at most clubs. Maybe i'm wrong but we do seem to have more fringe players than ever before and more on DR than ever before. Whether they're all going to make it isn't the point, the point is we're obviously looking to make changes and go through a transition period.

Yes the Widdop story is a rumour and will be right up until the point he or a club makes an announcement. That's how these things usually work but well done for stating the bleeding obvious again.

If I was Widdop and moving to the UK I'd go to the club offering the best all round package, not the club with some good youngsters. That might be Leeds, it might not be but he won't be turning down a club the size of and with the history of Leeds because of a current lack of youngsters.



You know, you don't have to put a negative spin on everything Sal, it just makes you look a bit sad when you do TBH.

Isn't optimism and hope the main reason why we all support our teams? That's what sport's all about.
(for most of us)