I would like to be associated with the comments of the last speaker....

Certainly not. am I a Liberal, I was a Labour supporter and have been brought up with labour values, but old labour not the new labour we have now with our unelected leader

the Conservatives were very well I may add backed into a political corner by Bliar and his media spin. if they had been apposed to the war they would due to the way the media was controlled and spoon fed information been looked upon as unpatriotic, and that would not do for a party who want the votes just as much as labour. The whole war was built on a lie sold on one and continues on one, differing thoughts on why Afghanistan was invaded first a gas link running through Afghanistan to feed a power station in India is a thought, this gas line being built by American business to supply American built power stations in India was stalled by the Taliban, the same Taliban who were courted by American Presidents to start the project, this gas line is now either well on its way to being finalised or been completed. the political will, will eventually waver no matter what the posturing. and ideology will win in the end just like it did against the Russians in the 80's with help from America, and just like it did in the early 20th century against the British and Russian empire's who occupied land there....

Ahmen to that brother....

Wow did i even say that its you the politician, If they are our hope then no we wont but a little push from them will surely help .

Ps have you an agenda to upset everyone on here and do you have a timescale to do it in.

PPs will only get worse next week when you have more time online as the schools have broken up!!

Differant wars all together one was over a century ago and therefore largely an irrelevent comparison, and the other was fought with much inferior technology across the whole of afghanistan (as opposed to the current conflict which is by and large confined to the south and east of the country). To give a comparison, russian casualties (over a similar time period) were about ten times greater than allied casualties, while taliban casualty estimates are significantley greater, another major differance is the lack of support from the cia which the taliban needed to beat the russkis. The war in afghanistan will be won in the end, how long that takes and how many of our soldiers dont come home is another matter.

Wished i could share your optimism Pyeman i truely do. but we have to overturn centuries of lifestlye and also a religious will far more powerful than our political will.

I find that very hard to believe, if Blair and 'his media spin' could wield such power over the main opposition, how come he couldn't do that over people in his own party (including his own cabinet)?



I missed all the yells about this against Labour and the Lib Dems and all the others that voted against the war. In fact, I don't think that the main paper that would have such influence you suggest, The Sun, would fly in the face of [url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/2857637.stm63% of its readership[/url so much. In fact, the only front cover on the day of the invasion that showed a positive spin on the invasion was the conservative Daily Mail ([url=http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/869379/postslink[/url)



So what put off the other parties - the ones who did vote against the invasion?



Now there is one thing we can agree on

i am actually on leave in August but will be away on me hols, if i can get connected up on wifi i will try to keep intouch

I find that very hard to believe, if Blair and 'his media spin' could wield such power over the main opposition, how come he couldn't do that over people in his own party (including his own cabinet)?

because most Labour MP's id say are or were anti war even Mr Bliar was once when it suited,

i can understand how you look upon the Conservatives they are and still follow and jump on any ship for votes but as i saw it they were especially its leadership jostled into a no win situation by clever politics. and lets face it its not like they are strangers to sending the country to war, as for other parties id have thought they could like anyone with common sense see through the lies, as for the suns percentages i do find them very supprising for their readership

Do i know you ? Two things in common there mate

Yep.

Some of us still doing both, but must say am not a big fan of our MP! and also remember what the tory's did and want to do again

I myself don't mind Yvette Cooper, it's Wakefield Council leader Peter Box i'm not too keen on. I hope our Lee does well at Hull Uni and decides to try and take his job. I wouldn't be surprised if Ashley doesn't end up with Yvette's job in a few years time though.

Old Labour policies are fine, but unfortunately would not win an election and had it not been for Yvette and many of her contemporaries, then the Tories would be in power and we would have already seen the demise of the NHS and so much more than is already the case. The fact that has to be faced up to is that there are not enough traditional labour party voters in the country to vote Labour into power these days and the party has had to move a little to the right (OK some might say a lot), or otherwise be doomed to opposition for keeps.

Unfortunately, because the labour party has had to move with the times to capture the middle of the road voter, those on the left of the party have become more and more disillusioned and will vote for anyone but the official labour candidate, as we’ve seen recently with the people of Barnsley voting the BNP into power, they can’t see that voting against such as Yvette Cooper, is simply playing into the hands of the Tories and letting them in by the back door. OK Yvette is relatively safe in her seat, but others are not so fortunate and I have no doubt we'll see the poor get even poorer if (or when) David Cameron and his cronies are elected.

OK some of the things this labour government have done haven’t been very clever, and some of the stories coming out in the expenses claims scandal have tarnished the reputation of all MP’s. But where would the lower paid be if the tories were in power? well for a start there would be no minimum wage, that will no doubt go with pressure from the CBI, then watch for the NHS and more public services disappear by stealth. You may not agree with everything Yvette and the labour party are doing, but you can be sure that the alternative will be far less palatable.

Well said Danny 100% agree the tory's just tried to get a bill though to scrap the min wage and thats when their not in power!!

Please dont feel that you have too - the holiday break will do us all some good

no i insist i will deffinately be in throughout my holidays i think you guys are the best!!!!!!!

Danny boy1 wrote
"then watch for the NHS and more public services disappear by stealth. You may not agree with everything Yvette and the labour party are doing, but you can be sure that the alternative will be far less palatable."

Working in the public sector myself it is very worrying that you think all is fine and dandy and cuts haven’t ravaged some of the most dedicated workers in the country, Ambulance staff pushed to breaking point not enough vehicles to cover areas, last weekend Castleford Pontefract and some of its surrounding areas had 3 Ambulances manned, Fire and rescue services are being cut back in the guise of supposed modernisation not just putting the Fire fighters life’s at risk but also the general publics, police are pushed by figures and quotas and I have been talking to a few disillusioned officers who are saying they are pressured into making petty easy arrests to get their figures up on a monthly basis, as for the NHS my Auntie is a nurse and I am shocked at the pressure and over work Nurses have. yes im sure the Tories have plans but will it be much worse I cant see it myself, this is the tip of public workers never mind the council workers seeing colleagues laid off, and uncertain futures, there was a time when if you were a Local Government worker you had a job for life you had to endure lower than private sector pay but a half decent pension was the light at the end of the tunnel. even that if Labour have their way will be gone, as plans are already being done and rumours are rife that this is another cheap shot to save money........not improve services..

how very dare you

LOL its funny isnt it when reality hits

Or your version of 'reality'

ermmmmm dont know wether your having a pop at me, which if you are

or my view of public services









if you are the latter you really do have your head in the sand m8.

Did she actually take her nose out of the trough long enough to speak to the pheasants, now theirs a thing, double second home exes everyone, anyone would think we are due a election in the next 12 months

nah she was talking to the grouses instead