Where did I say that? - just because someone tells you something it doesn't mean you have to believe them. Labour were left in a no win position because they did nothing when they had the chance.

Theres probably a lot of truth in that and its probably true that Brown (and plenty of others) knew what was coming, and sat there watching the tsunami on a radar screen without daring to run for high ground in case they set a panic off.

If the UK had hit the panic button (say) in 2005 and took a tight grip of the UK finance markets, would it have made a difference ?

It may have saved the likes of Northern Rock who were left still standing without a chair when the music stopped but would any of the international banks have stuck around in a country where they couldn't breath for red tape, would they have acquiesced or simply gone elsewhere to continue with their orgy of smoke and mirrors "investing".

Brown was arogant and thought he had ended boom and bust.

Indeed. They should not have continued the neoliberal polices of the previous governments.

But they did - don't blame the Tories, no one forced Blair to turn into a Tory he did it of his own volition and no doubt you helped to vote him all three times?

The likes of Balls are in complete denial about any of this - it was all somebody else's causing. Which we all know was only part of the problem, pity he scraped in at the last election might have brought he down a peg or two.

Unlikely that Barclays, RBS and BOS would have moved and Brown basically sunk Lloyds by forcing them to bail out halifax/bos.

Quote Sal Paradise="Sal Paradise"But they did - don't blame the Tories, no one forced Blair to turn into a Tory he did it of his own volition and no doubt you helped to vote him all three times? The likes of Balls are in complete denial about any of this - it was all somebody else's causing. Which we all know was only part of the problem, pity he scraped in at the last election might have brought he down a peg or two.'" Exactly. This article sums it up very nicely. blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/iainm ... -disaster/

Quote Sal Paradise="Sal Paradise"But they did - don't blame the Tories, no one forced Blair to turn into a Tory he did it of his own volition and no doubt you helped to vote him all three times? The likes of Balls are in complete denial about any of this - it was all somebody else's causing. Which we all know was only part of the problem, pity he scraped in at the last election might have brought he down a peg or two.'" Exactly. This article sums it up very nicely. blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/iainm ... -disaster/

"Turn into a Tory"?

I don't he was ever anything other than a neoliberal. There are reasons that pretty much the first thing that he did when he became leader of the Labour Party was to remove Clause 4.

But it is also worth pointing out (not for the first time) that a substantial swath of the popular media made it pretty much impossible to present any genuinely alternative policies.

Unfortunately, we have a dumbed-down public discourse in the UK, in which some media simply present political debate on polices as front pages saying that the lights would go out. And substantial swathes of the UK populace simply believe such hyperbolic nonsense, without looking any further.



Ultimately yes, it financial crisis and subsequent recession [iwas[/i someone else's doing – the banks and big finance. On a global scale.

I agree to a point with your views on Blair, but Balls/Brown could have done more the sub prime mortgage issue was only going to end one way as was the gambling culture on the trading floors of these banks. Not regulating was a contributory factor and for that Balls must take his share of the blame

They wouldn't have moved lock stock and barrel but they would have relocated their "investment" (sharking) departments to less stringent areas of the world, and then still shot themselves in the foot.

That would have been ok let the Cayman Isles bail them out or just let the investment arm fail by the way side ala Lehman

That's naive in the absolute extreme.

You saw what happened when NatWest had a computer glitch for a weekend (it went on for much longer with Ulster Bank). Now imagine the panic that would've ensued if people realised that their Northern Rock and RBS cards no longer worked. Not only that, all those employed by companies that banked with those two couldn't process payments, leading to a very real knock-on effect among all of the rest of the banking sector.

We would have seen civil unrest not known since Cromwell's time, last year's riots would've seemed like a vicar's tea party in comparison.

You can blame Brown & Balls all you like but those fooking bankers were hiding the scale of the problem from their ferllow bankers and in some circumstances, even from their own colleagues. It's no wonder the FSA didn't flag the problem, so deep-seated was the scale and scope of the corrupt activities.