Well well well, what a year it has been politically. Brexit was good enough but then this. The liberal elite has taken one helluva kicking lately and it is majestic.

Was Dachau one of favourites and what it was about.
You really don't like people who think do you.

The interesting thing about Trump and Brexit is that they show just how many votes a wealthy individual can effectively buy (Trump himself and Banks).

People were sold the dream of aspiration, they were told ''this will make you happy'', the cynical among us just saw it as way of getting us to part with our money for crap we can live without, the ones who bought into it are literally chasing a dream, they want it all and they want it now and next month they want a shinier one because the one they have isn't quite shiny enough, and so on and so on. I was at a dinner table only last week listening to the 'hardship' tale of someone who'd taken their big flash car in for a repair after crashing it and was given a little hatchback as a courtesy car. ''It's a long time since I've had to make do with something like that'' they proudly spouted as if the little hatchback was beneath their new found superiority. My wife glanced over at me with one of those 'did that actually come out of her mouth?' looks, I just bit my tongue!

I've got no problem with having ambition or wanting to better yourself, we're all trying to do it in some way or another, but like you said, there has to be an amount of social conscience. Aspiration is breeding a self-centred need for shinier ones, bigger ones, brighter ones, faster ones, more powerful ones, and in the age of social media a need to shamelessly show it off. Many would do well to remember that some people haven't even got one at all.

The demand to consume, consume, consume is burning the planets resources ever more quickly and as the 1 billion Chinese and 1 billion Indians become more aspirational, this demand will accelerate.
The governments of the developed world keep patting themselves on the back for reducing their own carbon emissions, when, the reality is that, they have passed these emissions on to China and India.
Consumption will kill all of us eventually, either by eating and drinking ourselves into an early grave or, bleeding the planet dry.

Back on subject, Trump will look after no. 1.
Himself and his family first, then his inner circle, followed by white Americans and maybe some others later on.
He seems to have no concern for anything too far outside his own back yard.

The guy is a billionaire why does he need to be president to look after this group?



Isn't that why he was voted in by the people of USA and similarly why we are leaving Europe?

It's arrogance , it's like when we see a new owner at a sports club , how many times on these pages have we seen " He's a successful businessman , of course he'll do better than the last one " this despite the last one being also a previous successful businessman

Being good at one thing doesn't make you necessarily good at everything , I built a reasonably successful business from scratch , employing 25 people turning a healthy profit from a 3 million + turnover

Did it last ? , no it had a life span , I tried other fields without success , quite often being in the right place at the right time just works , just as it has for Mr Trump this time

Is he the right guy to run the worlds most important country ?

Some people seem to think he is.

Ditto Mr Hitler , Mussilini ans Stalin

I'm not sure they voted for Trump.

Out of 43 million , there's a good chance they did actually

We had a documentary on the ABC (equivalent of the Beeb) the other night re Trump. The most interesting thing by far was when the female reporter was talking to a couple of older women who voted for Trump. She tried several times to elicit some kind of outrage on behalf of all women re Trump's misogyny, but she couldn't. It was like they were talking a different language (including a fair degree of patronising tone thrown in for good measure).

In a nutshell that interview summed up for me the gap between the mainstream 'liberal' media and a big chunk of society. Its not so much that these women weren't outraged, but the reporter simply could not comprehend why. They might be dumb and ignorant, but she had a total and utter failure to comprehend their views and as a result had no way to communicate with them.

Replace sexism with racism (or immigration) or protectionism and I expect you'll see exactly the same kind of non-communication with many 'average' people who voted Trump or Brexit. What passes for the mainstream has moved on and just doesn't get that a large section of society not only hasn't moved on but doesn't want to, and more to the point resents being told they are fools or bigots for not agreeing.

I genuinely struggle to see how the generally upper middle class mainstream media can re-enage (or in many cases engage for the first time) with these people.

BR youve tripped up the hard left usual suspects on here with that one. The silence is deafening.

The liberal left are wholly intolerant and censorious of alternative views. They seen incapable of seeing the irony in the rabidity.

Although I agree with your last comment, it was the upper middle class that voted for Brexit over here.
The Brexit protesters, who want things to happen instantly, are the over 60's, you know, the ones that read the Daily Mail & Telegraph and always turn up to vote.
They remember when Britain was Great and we ruled the commonwealth and taught the world to read and write.
The "average people", slightly disaffected with politics after the banking crisis , just follow the lead from the tabloids, which just happen to be owned by the right wing Tory loving press.
I get that many, many people are p'd off with the way things have been and who can blame them but, change for the sake of it, isn't neccessarily a good thing.
After all Hilter filled a void and sold a dream to the masses.

You always have to have the last word.

What is change for the sake of change. If we don't change we get more of what we're p155ed off with don't we. What you trying to say?

Don't forget the over 60's will be far more familiar with the Hitler era, but hey.

BR comment [iThe liberal left are wholly intolerant and censorious of alternative views. They seen incapable of seeing the irony in the rabidity[/i. couldnt be more true with you

Give me liberal left anytime (although it's certainly a new one on me) . it's eminently preferable to anything associated to Farage.
I'll leave you to select one of the many titles that have been attributed to him over recent months.
He's been particularly good at brown nosing Trumps rear end , not a place that too many people would want to go.

Dally's.

Maybe, but we know Many people in high places will follow suit...Our current PM included, when she finally gets an invite to the Tower

Re-count underway in Wisconsin so in a few days we get to see Trump win the state again.

So one minute "the silence is deafening" and when someone replies they "have to have the last word"?

OK

It's good to know that the leader of the free world lies awake at night, wrestling with the really key questions impacting on world affairs. Like whether a topical comedy show is actually funny; or if the person impersonating him is doing a decent job. And then decides to troll China.

Oh fantastic, now him & Putin are planning on upping the ante re Nuclear Weapons. www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-38410027 I remember the last "Arms Race" & it sucked. I fondly recall one Sunday morning, back in the day, when the siren went off (obviously a malfunction or human error, probably the second) but I rushed into the room to see if there was anything on the telly, but the short time it took me to realise Armageddon wasn't happening that day, it was forever engraved in my memory.

Oh fantastic, now him & Putin are planning on upping the ante re Nuclear Weapons. www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-38410027 I remember the last "Arms Race" & it sucked. I fondly recall one Sunday morning, back in the day, when the siren went off (obviously a malfunction or human error, probably the second) but I rushed into the room to see if there was anything on the telly, but the short time it took me to realise Armageddon wasn't happening that day, it was forever engraved in my memory.

I grew up in North Manchester, my parents' house overlooked the city from a hill about 6 miles away. I vividly recall hearing the siren going from time to time, clearly drills of some sort, but spooky as hell and a little confusing as I'd only ever heard that particularly haunting form of siren in black & white WWII movies.

I also recall at about age 7 being absolutely terrified by a news report which explained the various degrees of damage if a typical Soviet device were to detonate over Manchester.

And yet I still handled it better than Generation Snowflake handles anything.

I Remember the man from the "Barrats" advert informing us what to do should a nuclear bomb fall.

"Get in the bath"

"Hide under the stairs"

"Tag the dead and leave them outside"

They dont make adverts like them anymore