Let me get this right: you want people on benefits to do work that is currently being done by people who are paid a proper wage to do such jobs?

That'll boost the economy.

But CallMeDave and Ozzie are telling us we are spending too much on the public sector.
They are squeezing councils into sacking people.
Those people are ending up on the dole.

You see, by HM Gov telling Councils to save x percent, the councils then look at what they spend and see that they have contracts with private firms ... they can't renege on those contracts ... so they have to reduce something else by more-than-x-percent in order to get to x percent overall.
The things being cut are probably the very sort of thing that you are saying unemployed people should be doing.

And I'm also fairly sure that they won't have objected too much to the proposition of free labour.

As I've mentioned before, the government has effectively been advertising for big businesses (Unilever & McDonalds, for starters) in its 'health advice' - which came only a few months after the government invited the same companies to discuss public health.

These are also some of the same (very) big businesses that promised to create the jobs that would remove the effects of the cuts. They are not doing this.

Perhaps one should look at corporate donations to the Conservative Party ... I do suspect such things a entirely mutual arrangement based, not least, on ideology.



That doesn't entitle them (or any other company) to free labour. They pay lots of tax because they make millions and millions in profit - although not enough, according to the City earlier this year, which isn't happy with Tesco's growth. Which does raise a different question about why we need continued growth.

This is essentially like a tax break: yet every one of the FTSE 100 companies is already using tax havens, so why do big companies need further hand outs (in effect) from government? They're not poor. They're not suffering.

If we seriously think that some claimants might benefit from some form of 'work experience', then I would far rather see people do things like working for a spell with elderly patients in a hospital. It is more socially productive - potentially on both sides. But I am very wary of forcing people into working for their benefits - not least because it assumes that we have a nation of skivvers. Ys, some people take the proverbial. But the majority of people who are out of work do not. They want to work. They want to earn a living. They want to get a proper wage with all that means. There is a very causal tendency among many people to fall into the trap of assuming a nation of the workshy. A little as people assume a nation of people dodging work because they're on the sick - whereas the facts (and the personal stories) tell a different story - for which you can see the relevant thread on this forum.

And so it should, seeing as it makes more profit than most businesses, it's only right that it should pay more in tax.
Nonetheless, Tesco has been (at least) suspected of paying much less than it should by utilising a web of Swiss and Luxembourg companies.
Add to that Cadbury's (i.e. Kraft), Vodafone, Walker's Crisps etc etc ad nauseam ... and pretty soon you could pay off the entire deficit.

Are you saying, in effect, that we're not "all in this together"?

Brace yourself lady ... Yes.

In the words of the lovely Leona Helmsley [i"... only little people pay taxes[/i".

Really? Then the ISP you are using would be interested in that then.

Will you push me along in my wheelchair while I repair the roads? Will you help me put my splints on when my wrists and fingers are so swollen I can't move them from clearing chewing gum off the streets? Will you take me to A&E when I collapse from severe fatigue? Will you come and get me out of bed, take me to the toilet, wash me and dress me the next day so I'm ready to "earn" my benefit money all over again? Oh, you won't?? Suppose I'll have to wave "byebye to my free money" then and just be sick and disabled in the gutter. Idiot.

Sorry about that, it's just that we used to have an itinerant poster who hailed from Wakefield and used to post surprisingly similar guff to yours. I thought you might be related.

I will again state i dont live in Wakefield. I live 11.3 miles from the centre. How do i know a travel there to work. Is that good enough for you micro questioning

One mans guff is another mans sense.

After your pathetic squealing earlier, perhaps you'd like to post a presponse - or is that as considered as you can manage?

You didn't answer my question either. Will you be willing to help a sick and disabled person to earn their "free money"?

Why do want to put people out of existing jobs, for them to be done by people on benefits?

And the poor sod's who want a job but due to this won't be able to get one can just go and spin I guess.

[url=http://www.google.co.uk/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=tesco+tax+avoidance&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&redir_esc=&ei=_43OTruuE5D78QPQ9_ndDwor possibly not[/url

Is that like getting your retaliation in first?

[url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/apr/13/tesco-revives-jersey-vat-avoidanceno, not them m'lud[/url

[url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/savings/8913267/32700-the-amount-the-average-family-needs-to-earn-just-to-get-by.htmlJust to get by.[/url

In the last set of published accounts Y/E 26/2/11 the company paid 864m in corporation tax add to that the employers NI which will be between 750m-1bn I would suggest they are making a substantial contribution to the tax revenues of this country.

Obviously they don't count in you and your lady's consideration of who are exactly the tax payers!!

As usual these simple facts are lost in your big company bashing crusade!!

I don't think any big business would categorically say it would - regardless of circumstances - create unnecessary jobs. What the government intimated was it expected the private sector to pick up the people who were to be made redundant in the public sector. It said it would create an environment where business could flourish - has that happened!! SME's were supposed to have access to funds for capital projects and operating cash flow - has that happened? In the same breath the government say growth will be virtually non-existent - how do they expect the private sector to absorb these jobs?

I agree regarding your last point to a certain degree. Is your view that those on the dole should be doing something for their money if so then community projects is the correct use of this resource. If the idea is these people get experience that might lead to a job then perhaps putting them into a sector where it is generally agreed there will be less opportunities is perhaps not the best strategy.

On donations, you think it is OK for unions to dictate the policies of the labour party - Ed got the top job because the unions decided that, but its not OK for the Tories to do the same?

Tax collection is a careful balance - if you close all the loop holes you would most likely reduce the total tax take. Companies will always look to reduce their tax bill - it frees up money for capital investment, dividends - which are taxable etc. If I could find a way of paying less tax I would and I suggest so would you.

Tax avoidance to the point of evasion is not just limited to some big businesses.
In my experience, lots of one-man-band self employed type businesses have turned income tax and VAT (if they qualify at all) evasion into an art form whenever cash is involved. Plus not declaring the full cost of jobs or even omitting some, plus all manner of expenses concerned with domestic spending are often put against their business as long as it looks about right in the accounts. Petrol/diesel for instance.
Then there is self-assessment.
Thank goodness for employees and PAYE and Corporation Tax and businesses/companies that keep proper records.

At least they are a little more transparent.

So it's all OK because they pay some tax?

They should be paying all of their tax liabilities, not employing complicated tax vehicles to cheat the exchequer and by extension, cheat the poorest and most vulnerable in our society.

Do you drive a Hillman Avenger?

We've moved on quite a way since 1972



Not that load of old fanny again?

So, it's OK to avoid paying taxes, if you free up money for capital investment? Baloney, they should pay the taxes due, simple as. I would relish handing over £250 millions to HMRC every year because it would mean I'd be trousering at least that amount