There have always been huge imbalances in sentencing - James Boulger's killers got 8 years never even getting to adult prison. Jon Venables has proved to be a psychopath in adult life. Lee Bowyer got nothing yet Chev Walker got time for virtually the same crime. When you have a system that relies on a judge for a sentence you will have inconsistencies. The problem with rape its one person's word against another who do you believe - both parties should either be named or not it is not fair that the man is named and woman not? This is not a new situation it goes back for ever.

Domestic violence is a different ball game and those men/women should be locked up for a long time as should those who perpetrate honour (sic) killings.

As for Johnson the press call him out all the time but its not a shock - sadly nobody believes any politician because you know when they are lying - their lips are moving the whole lot of them. MP's simply don't have any public respect at all.

Saturday could have been avoided nobody turns up - what are the police supposed to do? You can't fine a load of kids for an illegal rave yet allow thousands to congregate in a park and ignore it. Anyone who thinks there weren't deliberate agitators out to cause trouble is delusional - the ginger-haired lady in all the photos - I rest my case.

Yes there are imbalances in sentencing, no doubt whatsoever.
As you say, the judge has plenty of discretion and as such, some sentences seem to be wrong.

The point that Jess Phillips made was bang on the money and for people to to be given longer sentences for damaging public property , compared to rape or worse, seems crazy and it's interesting how influence can come from "above" in certain circumstances, also, the "quality" of the defence, which comes down to pound notes, will always be a major factor, which skews the justice system in favour of the better off.

As for the vigil on Saturday, it was nailed on to end badly and of course it did.

Looks like we can’t have peaceful protests now. Facism is well and truly alive in this country.

protests that cry that all men are violent murderers and should not be allowed out after 6pm, doesn't sound peaceful to me, sounds a symptom of the ridiculous world created in recent times.

A legal clampdown on protests, in advance of some new form of austerity, does make you wonder what is coming our way.
No question that there will be some very difficult choices, between tax increases (in whatever form they take) and cuts to public services and it would appear that, just as Thatcher clamped down on the Unions, Boris & Co are going to try and gag the masses, it should be interesting.
It has to be said that the Tory ethos would always be cuts in spending instead of tax increases and there is certainly a huge fiscal hole to fill.

Strangely, to get through the pandemic, they have adopted some strong socialist policies, with increases to benefits, the furlough scheme and a huge increase in public spending and it will be fascinating how they return to "normal".

Go protest about it, then...

About a tenth that died due to labours lies.

But nowhere near those enabled and facilitated by that useless Tory Neville Chamberlain

I'm just pleased that you're happy.

What we've seen is that policy is no longer important to many of their supporters - they can do things that Corbyn would have raised an eyebrow at but it's all about culture wars and Trump-style identity politics. Gin up and distract people enough with that stuff and they can do what they like really, ideology is dead.

Where did I say I was happy? Go on, show me. That’s right, you can’t. Unlucky.

But I will break it down for you. You are quite happy to harp on about a death toll that has been caused due to unprecedented circumstances whilst supporting a party that lied and in the process caused the deaths of millions of innocent people (I know that to you it doesn’t matter because they weren’t white, but still, that’s Labour supporters for you!)

That’s why Labour will never get in. You epitomise what is wrong with them

I love the way you just make things up and then state them as fact. I guess thats why you're attracted to the Russian sponsored adulterous serial liar.

How many have we helped in Yemen with our continued arms sales to Saudi Arabia.

What am I making up? Wrencat is so incensed about a worldwide pandemic that no one was prepared for but supports a party that lied through their teeth and caused the deaths of millions of innocent people from the Middle East.

And it was voted through with an absolute majority. Plenty on all sides will have lined their pockets. Wars are profitable, after all.

I'm no defender of Blair or of the Labour Party but let's not forget that 99% of Conservative MPs voted for the Iraq war compared to 75% of Labour MPs.

100% of Liberal Democrats and 100% of SNP MPs, of course, voted against but I doubt 'Steph' supports either of them which makes the whole thing another bit of lazy trolling.

Yes but based on evidence presented by the Labour government that was wildly inaccurate. Most decent people would support action of this nature if they genuinely thought national security was at risk - the fact that more Tories voted for it than Labour surely suggests one group puts the security of its citizens above all other?

It could also be that 25% of the Labour MPs simply didn't believe their leader?

Brilliant.
The ones who voted against were unpatriotic, Labour who voted for were liars and the only virtuous ones were those apparently gullible Conservatives.

I applaud you for this framing, it's genius and echoes one of those most beloved and despicable right wing lies: that people they disagree with don't love their country.

Very possibly. I know I didn’t either.

The absence of WMD was framed by much of the press that initially supported the war as a surprise. But there was plenty of coverage and expert opinion suggesting that there were few or none well in advance. Not least from the UN weapons inspectors. It was also obvious that while as Sadaam Hussein was a horrible piece of faeces, he had nothing to do with 9/11.

The circumstances and (British) policies that led to the creation of modern Iraq, after the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, are interesting. The recent Adam Curtis documentary series touched on it and it is outlined on Wikipedia, of course.

Was the evidence that Blair was using not from our "friends" across the pond.
Either way, if America says jump, it's very hard to keep our feet on the ground.

It's the price that we have to pay for their support when we need it.

It wouldn't have mattered who was in power, it would have been impossible to say no, even if, as has been proven since, the WMD simply weren't there.

Nail......Head



And also all the Tory Arms Dealers pushed it

I don't think this is quite right. Maybe in modern times and obviously with Conservative leaders who would be all-in for any war going but I do think there was something specific to Blair which made him more likely to want to join in than other Labour leaders.

Let's not forget Good Old Mr Wilson who managed to resist the pressure at a much more difficult moment when we were much more reliant on the USA financially but who reversed the previous Conservative government's initial involvement and decisively kept us out of Vietnam.
I don't think that even crossed Blair's mind with regard to Iraq.

You may be right about Wilson but, the point still stands.
How much choice do you think that Blair actually had and what may have been going on in the background to help "convince" him to join the Yanks.
It's certainly a fair assumption that ANY Tory PM would have done the same and perhaps only Corbyn on the Labour side of the political line would have said no, had he been PM, which he never got too close to becoming.

I would have been very difficult to say ‘no’. However, Blair was a very keen advocate. The US would have gone in anyway and it would have been a fiasco (I recommend the book of that title by Thomas E. Ricks) with or without the UK. But it was with the UK thanks in very large part thanks to Blair.

That, along with being asleep at the wheel (see also the entire economic system) for the financial crisis of 2007-2008 and PFI were the major failings of New Labour, imo. Would it have been better under Hague or Duncan-Smith or Howard? Probably not. But that is like trying to shift the blame for Johnson’s failings to Corbyn.

Would you say the likes of Corbyn - who voted against are patriotic?

Most knew there was a significant element of doubt but I suppose the inbuilt colonial mentality set in with the Tories - let's kill Johnnie foreigner - is that what you are really trying to say.

The Tories I'm sure didn't agree with Blair but their love/arrogance of/about Britain override common sense.