Yes, a massive failing by Boris Johnson, Matt Hancock, and the NHS Trust Management

Had my Covid jab last Friday. Had it earlier than my age group would suggest because of having Epilepsy (I'm in group 6) No idea why this is the case, but I'm very grateful anyway. Hopefully this will prevent me from catching this horrible disease. Folk a lot younger than my 57 years have sadly died from Covid-19.

Just had my invite. I’ve only just turned 50. They must be flying through the groups.

Boris and Hancock treated the patients?

I had my first ZA vaccination on Saturday morning (34, no underlying issues), and it absolutely floored me. Hopefully the 2nd one won't be as bad.

God the youth of today

Had mine yesterday, had a high fever last night but a couple of ibuprofen fixed it. Didn't get much sleep but other than that I feel fine now. Second dose of AZ is better. I had the flu jab for the first time in October and it wiped me out for 4-5 days.
Worst I ever had was the old Typhoid jab. I thought someone had poured petrol on me and set me on fire.

I had the PFizer only side effect I had was a sore arm for a couple of days

Had the AZ one yesterday.
Very efficient conveyor belt operating at the local surgery.
Jabbed up and shovelling concrete 20 minutes later.
Side effect-less, happily.

Looks like Boris & Co are getting the vaccine program about right.
The UK certainly seem in better shape than most of our former friends in the EU.

Perhaps the most surprising issue, is that the delays for next month appear to be due to a batch of the "oxford" vaccine being delayed in India ??

Yes stopped by the Indian government for their own population. It sounds the same as the EU who were heavily criticised by the government but not questioned by Johnson in respect of India probably because we wants a trade deal with them.
It would appear condemnation only stretches as far as the next trade deal when everything can be forgiven or forgotten.

Also had the Pfizer one. Same as reported from many others - arm ached for about 2 to 3 days. At night I had to sleep on the other side because it ached to lie on it, but during the day no real problems. My Mum had the same with Pfizer.

Dad had AstraZeneca. First day afterwards no symptoms, second day he felt like he had Covid for about 12 hours and had to lie in a darkened room, then had a miraculous recovery and was right as rain. Symptoms didn't even last 24 hours but he did feel rough.

Me dad had the Pfizer and apart from a bit of discomfort with a sore arm no other problems, me mum on the other hand had the Astra Zeneca and it completely floored her for 2 days.

There's politics aplenty in all of this.
Having said that The EU seem to be making a bit of a balls of their own vaccine program, too much in fighting and not enough getting on with the job and their bickering over the AZ vaccine has clearly added to their problems.

I don’t think it is really being run at the EU level? Individual member states may be doing poorly, and making some (imo) odd decisions, but [imostly[/i I think it is being rolled out at a national level. With some co-operation, I’m sure. But healthcare delivery is very heterogeneous across EU countries.

It is. But that doesn't fit with the right wing obsession with the EU, or their previous narrative that the EU was a controlling monster that over-ruled the nation states.

Painting the difficult problems various countries have faced as an EU thing therefore suits their purposes for a variety of reasons, not least that it distracts from the previously disastrous job the government had done throughout the pandemic.

I think you are wrong with the first paragraph but spot on with the second.

Anyone who doesn't think the EU is the ultimate Big Brother with the most protectionist attitude of any major organisation then they are blind to the real EU.

Nobody can deny the handling of the earlier stages of the pandemic have been a disgrace - Boris and his cronies were too slow, weak and lacked any kind of coherent strategy. That can also be levelled at the NHS too.

The EU is protectionist externally, in the same way as the US and other major economies. However, it has cut protectionism internally among member states substantially. So we gave up the external protection and internal ease of access to a very large and nearby market. You can make the small and nimble argument for new trade deals but because we have have gone full open doors/low tariffs for imports globally we haven’t got much to offer in trade negotiations. Why would other countries offer us better access when we have already given away the farm? We definitely can’t be accused of selfishly protecting our economic interests - whether that is down to generosity or stupidity is a matter of opinion.

Brexit wasn’t driven by economics though. A country is more than just its GDP, and I accept that the benefits, although intangible, are nonetheless real for many people. Unfortunately for me, it is stuff that I don’t value much personally and I don’t think is very healthy for us nationally, in an opiate of the masses kind of way.

I doesn't take a huge leap of faith to see a European super state controlled by the likes of Von der Leyen where by the rules are set from the centre by a host of unelected bureaucrats. The EU has been gradually moving from a free trade arrangements to super state. You only have to see the handling of the vaccine program and the impact it has had in France, Germany, Poland etc. A state where the biggest players manipulate the rules to best suit their particular needs.

Perhaps giving up your independence is a situation worth enduring to get access to the EU - you can't have both. Perhaps we need to be able to stand on our own two feet a bit more - it will definitely sharpen up our commercial endeavours over time.

It is possible, and the EU is far from perfect. But we assess both the risk and the hazard differently. I think it is a smaller leap of faith to see this not happening. There are other hazards that concern me more (broadly, a continent-wide rise in far right populism) and that [imight[/i mean that we actually do end up being better off out. However, for now the risk, while bigger than I’d like, remains small and so I didn’t see an urgent need to depart. But we have, so there you go!



Okay, I may genuinely have missed something here. There seems to be some conception that there is a single EU vaccination program, that is to the detriment of efforts in individual member states. That isn’t the case, as I understand it. While national decision makers take advice from the EMA, after regulatory approval for which the EMA is entirely responsible, they make their decisions independently. For example the (imo strange) decisions to suspend use of the AZ vaccine were taken independently in some member states and in not others.



Gosh yes - it’d be terrible to live in a state where the wealthy and powerful exert their influence in pursuit of their best interests, exploiting the poor and disempowered as necessary. Fortunately, we live in the UK - home of fairness, where everybody’s voice weighs equally.






Where do you see the greatest opportunities to sharpen? Why do you think they have been neglected to this point?

This stuff about worries about unelected bureaucrats, a centralised state and powerful actors manipulating the system.

It's amazing, even factoring in the lies that make people think this stuff is true about the EU, and their seemingly permanent myopia that they never take a look around over here and think, "wait a minute...."

Each of the countries within the EU are able to negotiate their own deals and regulations for vaccines , much like we could have blue passports at any time.

The difference is if we don't like it we can change it every 5 years - can't do that with the EU now can we?

You seem to be in a minority of one when it comes to the attitude of the EU - you view is its a welcoming open arrangement that is available to everyone - no protectionism, no real rules of engagement nice free and easy. Perhaps you need to heed you own advise and "wait a minute"

The "protectionism" is ok if you are on the inside and although it's (very) early days, it was a damn sight easier trading (in either direction) as part of the club.
At the moment it's a right mess.
The government will say it's just teething troubles but, we SHOULD have had most of last year to get used to the new arrangements.
As it was, there was no time to properly prepare,. because the deal was only "agreed" at the 11th hour, leaving some businesses and of course most of Ireland (both sides) with serious amounts of unnecessary pain, much of which is still ongoing.

To answer your points:
This country has been debating staying in the EU since Major was in charge - it wasn't a snap decision it was just the government were not prepared to give the population the opportunity to vote on it - Blair promised but never did. If you are going to leave when would you suggest a good time was?

Perhaps to don't see a connection between high levels of vaccination and controllable levels of infection/death. Perhaps its a myth that virtually everywhere in Europe cases are rising except the UK. France-Paris back in lockdown, Croatia 50% increase, Germany doubled in March etc. UK 70% down in March. If the EU only allows dictates the supply of the vaccine and you get idiots like Macron playing politics then it will not end well. There was never any evidence that AZ jab was anymore harmful than a normal vaccine but it was produced by a UK firm so we end up a bonkers situation whereby the EU doesn't want to use the drug but also doesn't want the UK - who have no issues - to use it - what does that tell you about the EU?

Of course but we could have voted in John and Jeremy to shake things up - we can't really do that in the EU can we? If the Germans say jump everybody else simply goes how high - half the members are subsidised they are very unlikely to bite the hand that feed?

Where could we sharpen up - where do you start: Manufacturing, main stream banking, public sector, NHS, environmental etc. Where are we good - innovation, especially military, advertising, commercial banking etc.