The elephant in the room is the closure of many a secure mental health units across the country. In favour of more open door facilities. It's all fine and dandy when these individuals are taking their medication. But along with these less secure units, come lesser moderation and monitoring. It only takes somebody to feel like not taking their medication, and tragedies can happen.

Now this is an excellent point.

Care in the community was a disastrous policy. How many incidents like this have we seen in the years since?

Forget the colour of his skin and concentrate on the ultimate get-out clause - mental illness.

Denying mental illness while claiming Jesus spoke to you while you were cleaning out the rabbit hutch.

Just the average day for the lazy preacher.

Are you and jesus saying this guy wasn't mentally ill?

Well, what's the criteria for being mentally ill these days?

You tell me?
The insinuation that he wasn't, came from you, not me.

Problems with logical thought
A sense of unreality
Unusual or exaggerated beliefs about personal powers to understand meanings or influence events
Fear or suspiciousness of others or a strong nervous feeling
Uncharacteristic, peculiar behaviour
Developing irrational beliefs
Serious disturbances in perception (hallucinations)
Hearing and seeing things that others don't

That's just some symptoms of mental illness.

How about the belief somebody is sprawled out on a big fluffy cloud upsairs?
You've gotta be a bit cuckoo to swallow that one, surely?

Well I would class that as an irrational belief, but then I'm not a mental health worker, so if I were to suggest Kirkstaller should be sectioned for his own and the general publics safety then I'm not sure what credibility my suggestion would carry...

If the murderer says Jesus/Allah told him to do it is that ok?

Yorkshire's most infamous serial killer was sent on a mission fron the big chief upstairs so it could be true.

They are just some of the symptoms of some and varied psychotic mental illnesses.

Re, our old friend Kirkstaller. I liked what a clinicial psychologist once said on television. "If you talk to God, it's called prayer. If he talks back, it's called schizophrenia"

I've done a little research into the phenomina experienced by kirkstaller in which he was visited by a deity whilst cleaning out the rabbit cage in hsi garden - I don't think it was Jesus at all but in fact was El-ahrairah, the spiritual rabbit guide from Watership Down come to tell him to release his bretheren from the cage and stop mis-treating rabbits in future.

In fact there is documented evidence of this in one of El-ahrairah scriptures in which he writes, "What a fekkin day I've had, went to warn off a human from some captive bunnies and the daft barstard worships ME now, this isn't how its supposed to happen..."

If he'd looked closer then kirkstaller would probably have noticed the buck teeth and big ears on his "Jesus"...

In a society where we are told to respect other people's beliefs, cultures etc. it really doesn't apply to the Sin Bin does it.



If someone wants to worship a kitten for example, then so be it.

I don't know of any kitten worshipers who try to enforce worship of the kitten – or their ideas of the kitten's views – on everybody else. And looking at my kittens, I hate to think what one would suggest they wanted society to do.

Unfortunately, for many in assorted religious groups, 'respect' only ever works one way.

Indeed. it could almost remind one of the Puritans, who left Plymouth for the New World claiming that they were persecuted. In reality, that 'persecution' was them not being allowed to persecute those that they did not agree with.

I'm a little shocked he keeps them bunnies.
Let's be honest here, their morality is at all time low.
Father's will hump babies, brothers will hump sisters, they really don't give a flying fook who they have a piece of action with as long as their getting some.

There probably bang at it now whilst their keeper is down churchville praying for us sinners.

Tis a disgrace I tell thee.

I'd say stabbing a stranger for no logical reason fits the bill nicely.

It's an excellent general point. However, in this case the perpetrator was not previously known to mental health workers and so was not under any sort of treatment at all it seems.

Unlike Pokemon, you can't catch them all.

Ah. Hadn't caught up with that.

Just a general point on the issue of mental health issues that arise with no prior history, is there any correlation between the increased use of recreational drugs and/or alcohol and mental health ?

Its only anecdotal of course but there certainly seems to be desire amonst the young to drink to excess on a weekend far more than my generation did, the use of spirits and "pre-loading" before going out, coupled with much longer opening hours would be unheard of in my boozing days and the reported evidence of liver and kidney problems in those aged in their late twenties/early thirties would seem to corroborate that too.

I don't automatically respect anyone's belief, in fact I reserve the right to have utter contempt for any belief that is, to me, absurd.
I do however respect someone's right to believe whatever they like.


Quite, and if I want to criticise it, I shall.

I must admit, I am finding Rooster Booster's attempts at trolling quite amusing.

It seems to work on the basis of defending the loons – and claiming everyone else is unfair to them.

I totally agree with you on your first point MB. It is exactly what I'm driving at. I honestly believe that people will get on better if we had a chance of open dialogue instead of people bagging everyone out all the time.

And yes, that is also true of those Puritans.





Again, I agree with you too. It's not automatic. having a right to have utter contempt sounds a bit strong, "not like" may have made you look at lot less aggressive.





I don't attempt to troll AT ALL. My fascination with psychology and qualifications in counselling have made me see things a bit differently. I just notice that there are some on here who defend people's human rights (rightly so) but when it come to religion absolutely slam people of a different opinion to theirs.

We know about your own issues with religion, and I still think that you were incredibly honest in what you wrote. But think about the fact that you called religious people "Loons"??? Also you see it as me defending them, when I'm questioning the attackers. You've never asked what I think of the people I allegedly defend, like Kirkstaller. You read what I've written and processed it in your way.

If I met you, and could verbalise, rather than write down what I feel happens, you'd realise, I'm not a troll, nor fake. Ask Sadfish. He knows me.

I'll PM you something, if you'll read it. Let me know.

It has been known for decades that alcohol damages the brain. This would affect all sorts of cognitive and somatic functioning. I'm guessing that it would affect individuals in different ways.