He is just following the Johnson practice of making things up to back his failed argument. The strange thing is why would you start a thread questioning Keir telling a lie in Parliament which he apologised for when his hero Johnson lies at nearly every single PMQ’s and so far has not corrected his falsehoods once.
I have another question who dresses Johnson because during the one minute silence he looked like his suit came from the Worzel Gummidge range.

I assume you wear suits from the Worzel Gummidge range yourself? how else would you become such an expert

When elected officials start telling the electorate "I don't need a lecture from you" then something is very wrong. Same with Boris in the pub walking between tables - these people have lost all touch with ordinary people.

When Starmer says his wife works in the NHS you would think she was on the front - like the generals in the battle she is so far from the front line as it is possible to get.

At least Starmer stood up to the co owner whose objection was because he thought the word opposition meant they had to disagree with everything the Government do. I believe he thought it just killed old people so why did his business need to close. He is a classic pandemic denier and his selfishness would make an actual ideal Tory voter. I wonder if Johnson would have done the same or would he just hide in a fridge.
With regards the suit that must be one of the most stupid posts even for you. I have worn suits but you only need to see how he looked to come to the conclusion regarding his clothes and I didn’t mention his hair. I remember the grief Foot had to endure from the press and not a word about Johnson.

Do you genuinely think Labour have provided robust opposition to what has been a catastrophic handling of Covid by the government - vaccine apart. I think the landlord was not in favour of lockdowns and he is not alone in that.

The central question for me is this - did lockdown save or cost more lives i.e. how many more would have died and how many more will die because of the lockdowns.

Labour pointed out the many times Johnson was slow to do anything which resulted in unnecessary deaths. When it comes to the application of lockdowns Labour backed them because they believed they work. What do you want them to do and they have also been strong advocates of stricter border controls because they were needed at this moment but once again Johnson did nothing.
I guess you run a business, the lockdowns were indeed longer than they should have been but that was down to Johnson’s dithering, a trait he is well known for. It should be the government you support that need to be asked why we are where we are with deaths etc.and the impact on all types of business. It’s a pity you don’t know a Tory MP or you could maybe have gained privileged access to the various contracts or loans they were dishing out.

I think Labour wanted longer and tougher lockdowns especially a circuit breaker. They tried that in Wales - didn't work very did it?

What I wanted from the opposition was a challenge in how we could get the NHS to best serve the population not how could the population best serve the NHS. I would have liked Labour to suggest how we could have kept our schools open not extend the closure further which is what they wanted.

w
Surely the great problem for labour is the lost northern heartlands due to its attempts to deny Brexit and filling its front benches with morons and then electing the architect of its brexit policy as leader leaving its core support from plastic socialists called Tabitha and Tarquin and washed up socialists from the north who are still living in the 70s

The Tories have an 80 seat majority and you want Labour to provide robust opposition??? That's like asking someone to hold back a leaking dam with sellotape. I'm guessing you're one of the ones who wanted a Tory landslide in December 2019? Well, you got one. Enjoy it.

I like the way that the wind-up OP has been subverted to become an intelligent discussion.

Labour does seem to be stuck oscillating every decade or so between its socialist and liberal-socialist democratic wings, in a political era that has little emphasis on economics.

The Johnsonian Conservatives have done well by changing in some fundamental ways but managing to retain most of their traditional support. It’ll be interesting to see whether there is any sort of war for the soul (don’t laugh!) of the Conservative party (a bit like the never-Trump Republicans in the US) in the future or whether it continues in its current direction.

I simply wanted anything but Corbyn - and it seems so did the electorate

It will be interesting to see how the local elections go - gains for the Tories would be really bad news for Labour. It would appear Hartlepool is on a knive edge with the old Brexit party voters defecting 2:1 to the tories.

If the local elections go badly for Labour, Starmer could be on his way.
Not liked by the Labour left, it's to be hoped that some of the defectors like him.

With Bojo, jumping on the football "super league" issue, to try and gain some of the popular vote, it will be an interesting few weeks.
It's to be hoped that the predicted new wave of covid holds off long enough though. Bojo's "irrevocable" road map out of lock down is starting to look like a cul-de-sac.

Even if Starmer goes he'll be replaced by yet another middle-manager type Blairite from the righthand side of the party.

Until Labour come out to the nation, apologise for dismissing the working class vote for years, for ignoring Brexit and foisting top down management techniques onto local CLP's then you can forget it.
The brand has been smashed to pieces and a large portion of that comes from the same people who now DEMAND you back Starmer despite being offered nothing. These traitors briefed against, smeared against and leaked against the Labour party for years as someone was about to break up the boys club, trashing the brand as they went. They burnt the house down to get rid of Corbyn and now are complaining they have soot on their faces.

So the biggest thing Labour need to do is deal with internal party politics so that the hard left can settle some old scores?
People who think like that deserve the economic dust bowl the Tories will serve up. Pity the poor constituents though who could benefit from having decent representation interested in the issues of the poor and disenfranchised and powerless ie the people those in the Labour party should be fighting for. You'd rather leave them to the devastation the Tories will continue to bring than accept you can't have everything you want from those on the same side as you.

My bad. Wasn’t his local.

Still the gift that keeps on giving. No wonder no one votes Labour lmao

Quote ="wrencat1873" With Bojo, jumping on the football "super league" issue, to try and gain some of the popular vote, .'" Thats some quality spin there, even for you https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/foo ... 34111.html lol

Quote ="wrencat1873" With Bojo, jumping on the football "super league" issue, to try and gain some of the popular vote, .'" Thats some quality spin there, even for you https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/foo ... 34111.html lol

Quote ="Steph Curry"Thats some quality spin there, even for you https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/foo ... 34111.html lol'" You must have missed Bojo on every news bulletin saying that he was going to do everything in his power to stop the new league. Not being a reader of The Independent, I hadn't seen Starmer jumping on the bandwagon. There is an irony in ANY Tory not wanting greedy capitalists to prosper. The new League looked to fit pretty much all of the Tory ideals. Greedy fat cats wanting even more and not bothered about the working man. Clearly that aspect of the new competition is lost on you

Quote ="Steph Curry"Thats some quality spin there, even for you https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/foo ... 34111.html lol'" You must have missed Bojo on every news bulletin saying that he was going to do everything in his power to stop the new league. Not being a reader of The Independent, I hadn't seen Starmer jumping on the bandwagon. There is an irony in ANY Tory not wanting greedy capitalists to prosper. The new League looked to fit pretty much all of the Tory ideals. Greedy fat cats wanting even more and not bothered about the working man. Clearly that aspect of the new competition is lost on you

I believe Starmer is an Arsenal season ticket holder, I wonder what team Johnson supports.

But starmer has jumped on the bandwagon. So as a Labour supporter what you are basically saying is that it’s ok for starmer to do it, but not Boris because that’s not fair.

Noted

Starmer is actually interested in football and is a season ticket holder Johnson is not on both counts.

As any self respecting Labour supporter would, you are moving the goal post to suit your narrative.
Let’s break it down.

Labour supporter claims Boris is jumping on the bandwagon. I point out that starmer is too and you all start typing a load of nonsense saying starmer is entitled to but Boris isn’t.

It’s utterly laughable and I reiterate my point that this is why no one votes Labour because the party and its supporters are an embarrassment

Whereas those who vote Tory most certainly aren't

The disadvantage of being a Conservative voter are supporters like you.

43% of those who chose to vote, voted for the con party.

57% voted against them, even with Corbyn at the helm.
It's like watching the Wizard of Oz with the cowardly liar as head honcho.

Are you really pleased that the fool Johnson is going to be the person who will lead us into the post brexit nightmare and that he's the best we've got?