Don't want to go to much into the traumatic details but on Wednesday my son had been part of a group of high school pupils who had entertained a group of pupils from primary schools in mini Olympics as he's a sports leader .
He is 13 but enjoys responsibilities but like I said is 13 as was most of the group I'm lead to believe.

After the "Olympics" and the youngsters had gone I'm afraid the story turns sour...
The lads started to get rowdy and basicly messing about running trough girls lockers etc and during this pushing shoving laughing running my lad as shut a door behind him which as had a disaster ending .
A lad behind the door has lost half a finger.
Whilst this poor soul was being attended to in the first aid room my son tried tried and tried to apologise to his friend but a wall of teachers stopped him.
This child of course went by blue lights to A+E with my lad I know not injured but wanting to apologise.

This was 11:30 the school phoned us at 3:20 to tell us "they had no idea what had gone on but all of them had been messing around"

He had been isolated all day because he was upset , he had also dictated a statement and signed it.

Yesterday. Thursday.

He was isolated all day and told to change his statement , he refused he got threatened that if the police got involved his statement was not good enough and was handed one prepared and told to sign it .
He refused. Has they would not let him read it.

Later they gave him another different statement which they said he had a minute to glance over , its a few pages both sides . he refuses to sign and gets told he will be in iso again today and they might phone the police.

So of course we ring when he comes home as people he talks to have said their statement matches his and not forgetting the poor injured lad ....not interviewed yet.

The teachers say we can not see these statements they want him to sign in case the police want them !

We then pop the £6'000'000 question what about the teachers statement.
"They had been alone for at least 25minutes "

I'm going down to school in the morning at 11 and not sending my son until we go together he hasn't had any proper sleep since and is awake now. I know he's not the injured party but if only he could of said sorry to his face instead of Facebook.

Can teachers do this

The teachers are threatening your child with the police if he doesn't sign a statement he hasn't read.

I wouldn't be going to the school to sort this. I'd be going to the police.

Your child is 13 years old. The other boy is around that age. They should have not been unsupervised for so long.

The teachers are at fault for this happening. They are intimidating children to alter statements and threatening the children with the police if they don't do as told.

I don't think for a second the teachers are altering the statements to protect the kids. They are altering the statements to protect themselves.

It's probably too extreme to go to the police. It just angers me that the teachers are telling your son a blatant lie in order to get him to sign a statement. This is not a police matter, it was clearly an accident so it is wrong to scare a child with threat of the police if he doesn't do as they wish.

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Not wishing to hijack the thread, but this got me thinking at my school days. But when I was at school I was hit three times by teachers. I never told my dad because I knew I'd done wrong in the first place and didn't need the extra hassle involved in telling my dad. But I think in the 1990's if I'd have put in a complaint about teachers hitting me they'd have been fired.

The first time was in the 1st year of high school. I was among a bunch of kids who were lobbing snowballs. Just as I threw a snowball the teacher stepped into the window and saw me. I saw that he'd seen me, he beckoned me into the school. My first thought was, "**** that" but the kid next to me said I had to go in and I listened to him. As soon as I went into the school and the door closed behind me the teacher punched me hard in the shoulder. Man, I was not expecting that, I even peed myself a little. There was another teacher there and he was laughing.

Anyway, I knew that as it was me against two teachers so I knew it would have been pointless to tell my dad. The teachers would deny it anyway and it would be the word of one kid against two teachers.

In the second year, different school - we moved. I had two incidents. I don't know which came first.

One incident was in a maths class in a temporary classroom. The teacher was the softest teacher in the school. Classes in there with him were a joke. The class was playing up and the teacher had had enough. I don't remember what he said, I probably was messing about and wasn't paying attention, but the rest of the class has ceased their messing and I was the last one messing about. I realised my mistake and sat straight down and said sorry. The teacher was MAD. Me sitting down wasn't enough. He came bounding over, reached over the the kid next to me and dragged me over him. I don't remember how much he swung me around the room, but the joke after class was to ask me how my flying lesson was. Everyone in the class was stunned. I was a bit ashamed that the softest teacher in school had done that to me.

The last one was a gym teacher. Just outside the gym there were kids posters on the wall. Another kid dared me to put a boot print on a poster, so I did it. That ************* **** ******* then went and grassed on me to the gym teacher.

So in the changing room straight after the gym teacher tells me to give him one of my shoes and bend over. My thinking was, "He's not allowed to do this, he won't do it." so I took off my shoe and bent over. I thought he'd probably back down and tell me then next time I defaced the school I wouldn't be so lucky. But he did spank me, right in front of everyone.

I don't know how seriously I was actually considering it, but I was really mad and thought he'd just messed up big time my hitting me in front of a room full of kids. I was really considering punching the guy in the face, then smacking the grass. Now obviously I bottled it and didn't do it, but I was a lot closer than I ever thought I would be to punching a teacher.

The first one I know there'd have been no point in telling my dad and complaining. But the 2nd and 3rd incidents were in a room full of kids who saw it happen. If I'd told my dad and he'd put in an official complaint to the school, would those teachers have been at risk of being fired? It was an ordinary high school in West Yorkshire in the early 90's.

Is it a state school, under the control of the Local Authority or an academy or free school?

If anyone's wondering about the relevance, the school's status will determine where to go next if a satisfactory explanation is not forthcoming.

I'd also suggest that the OP records any conversations with the school/teachers and takes contemporaneous notes

why would the police get involved in a 'finger trapped in door' accident?

If it wasn't an accident.

This is disgraceful. All teachers are to blame.

If being the main word, I suppose.

As far as we are told so far tom foolery gone wrong. As wrote in the first statement.

"It must be worst than that"

Being said by the none present staff that have tried over the course of a day and half to get him to change his statement. The school won't tell us if the childs parents blame my son but in the age of Facebook etc it appears not.

My son wanted to come home on the day it happened and yesterday . on the day in question when they said at 3:20 he's in a mess I think he should of come home.

I'm going down in 50/minutes . I hope to have a happy resolve not something hanging over him all summer

Just playing devils advocate here but what if the teachers wanted to change your sons statement in favour of your son, ie from what your son has said in his statement if it were to go any further then you would get your ass sued and they are trying to prevent that?

Like I said, just playing devils advocate and trying to see another angle.

For a start the teachers/school should be commended for giving your lad and the others a bit of responsibility. Many kids flourish when given such a chance.

But then they should massively criticised for not supervising it properly. You can't just put a 13 year old in charge and then walk off and leave them.
At the team I coach we often get some of the older lads helping out with coaching the younger ones by giving them the warm up to take or parts of other sessions, but its always supervised by a coach.

As for the statements, that sounds incredibly dodgy to me. For a start I'm not sure whether a statement signed by a 13 year old is legally binding? Especially without a parent or guardian present. And getting him to change it or sign a pre-prepared one is very dodgy. Hull White Star might be right in that they might be trying to help him but it could be trying to alter the statements so that it doesn't seem like they were left unsupervised.

in which case the other child would have already complained to the police, and the teachers wouldn't have any need to be collecting statements on behalf of the police. If it is a police matter then the teachers should have nothing to do with it, and the boy should be giving a statement to the police only and in the presence of a solicitor and his parents.

Sounds to me like the teachers are trying to bully the child into changing his statement to suit their own needs in the schools internal disciplinary proceedings.

I was just answering the question that was asked.

If you read my first response I was very much against the teachers bullying the child by lying about police involvement.

If there was a suspicion that it was a deliberate act, then I think the teachers shouldn't have been threatening police involvement, they should have called the police straight in and let them investigate it. There was no reason for the teachers to talk about police involvement if it was an accident. And their invoking the police was bullying and intimidation.

Looks like the teachers may have been conspiring to pervert the course of justice? Jailable offence if so.

If it was an ongoing police case and they did this I'd agree. I don't think it's a police issue though.

I suspect that they are just trying to get the stories straight so that the kid gets his compensation from the insurance company and the teachers don't end up getting fired or severely reprimanded over it.

Or it could be a case of minimising the potential damage to the school.

Whatever it is I think they are doing it in a terrible fashion.

If it becomes a police case (as it may do or at least the teachers are threatening that) could it not be (maybe not, I do not know?). Could there be a question of black-mail or does that only arise where pecuniary gain is involved? A child has been seriously harmed, could that become a police matter or would it be always civil? The teachers / school are in the front line of a claim potentially and seem to have been acting (from what we can gather / infer) in a way that could falsify facts pertinent to that claim. If I were the teachers concerned I would be booking my one way ticket to South America now.

Will only be a police case if the child/ children have been neglected by the school. This will be brushed under the carpet. The only thing schools care about are offsted reports.

Write out a draft letter to the local rag, but show it to the headmaster first. State that if the school imposed discipline, starting with pupils wearing full correct uniform, and the children were supervised at all times, which they should be whilst in school grounds, then terrible accidents like this will not happen.

Worth mentioning the number of stand in teachers that have been brought in this year and the number who have been on long term sick.

Will only be a police case if the child/ children have been neglected by the school. This will be brushed under the carpet. The only thing schools care about are offsted reports.

Write out a draft letter to the local rag, but show it to the headmaster first. State that if the school imposed discipline, starting with pupils wearing full correct uniform, and the children were supervised at all times, which they should be whilst in school grounds, then terrible accidents like this will not happen.

Worth mentioning the number of stand in teachers that have been brought in this year and the number who have been on long term sick.

I've stayed out of this thread as I have insufficient facts to be able to comment but toast has deffo nailed it there.
If only they'd worn uniform, none of this would have happened.

I'm on about the general level of discipline in the school in the first place. A uniform is a statement of discipline and is the first piece of discipline a schoolchild encounters in his schooling years.

Have a look at children coming out of schools and what their uniform looks like. This generally tells you the quality of the school, which is primarily enforced by the headmaster.

IDS has the stats (or beliefs, if pushed) to back up this stupid 5hit.

Then for once, I must be in agreement with a Tory.

On reflection, if the OP's facts are correct then it may (although I am not sure of any ramifications for his son of so doing) be advisable to go to the police and explain exactly what has happened. They can then decide whether or not it is a police matter. If it is, then the teachers could be charged potentially be charged with perverting the course of justice. If not a police matter, so be it. The teachers come what may appear to have been attempting to contaminate evidence whether for a police enquiry or a possible / arguably probable civil action (by the victims parents on his behalf against the school for failure to keep order and protect their child). As a minor the son should not have been isolated but should have had a responsible adult to accompany him in order to ensure that he was not made to do something he did not understand or do something under duress. I think the lad did very well not to sign something he did not agree with. If this is pursued in any fashion I guess the teachers involved will be finished as teachers / headteacher - and rightly so if the OP is a fair summary of the facts. Having said that, the comment someone made about sweeping under the carpet is valid - chances are the police, school and local authority (if an LA school) will wish to do that.

I am NOT a lawyer and so do not take what I say as fact / good advice. It is, however, based on observation of other similar (but distinct) cases I have known of.

Not sure why the parents could be sued when the teachers school are in loco parentis. It's the school / teachers that may (I suspect, will) get sued. If that happens they will realise just how stupid they have been if the OP sums up what happened correctly (which I have little doubt he / she does).

the whole uniform enforcement thing only ever creates tension which leads to the little shiites being even more rebellious, it's complete . Naughty kids are naughty kids and telling them how to dress will just make them not want to comply with uniform rules even more.


On topic, it all smells very dodgy, I'd write to Ofsted, the local rag, and a councillor/MP saying what's happened.

I'll have a word with my mum when I see her, she used to work alongside ofsted to do with child protection sort of things and was very good at ripping teachers a new one when they didn't go by the book, she should know what to do/say.

Okay, so you've written to Ofsted, the local newspaper and your local MP.

But now you've found out that a couple of kids who witnessed the incident have both written statements saying that it was a deliberate act.

How do you feel NOW about sending those letters turning up the heat on the situation?

Or another scenario:

It was an accident, everybody says that. The teachers were just overstepping their mark and getting all the paperwork into place so that the incident was best resolved with minimal damage to every party. The injured child would have been properly compensated, the teachers given a written warning after they admitted being at fault, but otherwise everyone can move on.

But with Ofsted and an MP coming in 2 good teachers have been fired, the insurance company are refusing to honour the claim and it's going to take the court system years to reach a conclusion.

Is that a good thing?