George Osborne is looking for private firms to run segregated toll road sections on our motorways. Creating a two tier network were the rich will be able to zoom up and down the country in their Mercedes and BMW's while the average family will be stuck in traffic jams. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ds-newsxml The longer this government goes on the more we see the way thy view the world. Its not about bringing everyone together as a nation its about THEM and US.

George Osborne is looking for private firms to run segregated toll road sections on our motorways. Creating a two tier network were the rich will be able to zoom up and down the country in their Mercedes and BMW's while the average family will be stuck in traffic jams. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ds-newsxml The longer this government goes on the more we see the way thy view the world. Its not about bringing everyone together as a nation its about THEM and US.

The people who don't want to pay will benefit from having less traffic on the free section of the roads.

The M6 Toll seems to work pretty well, in my experience.

Quote ="EHW"The people who don't want to pay will benefit from having less traffic on the free section of the roads. The M6 Toll seems to work pretty well, in my experience.'" The M6 toll has been a failure, traffic volumes and income are far lower than expected. Hence why no other companies have come forward with plans to build private motorways. www.shropshirestar.com/news/2010 ... e-failure/ www.publicservice.co.uk/news_story.asp?id=14002 www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/new ... laims.html The only way the government would get private companies interested in toll roads is if they cannibalised the existing motorway network, and gave lanes over to private operators. This would result in increased congestion as you would then end up with an empty outside lane used only by Nigel and Jeremys in their Porshe's and BMW's, while everyone else, including lorry drivers would have to crawl along the remaining two lanes.

Quote ="EHW"The people who don't want to pay will benefit from having less traffic on the free section of the roads. The M6 Toll seems to work pretty well, in my experience.'" The M6 toll has been a failure, traffic volumes and income are far lower than expected. Hence why no other companies have come forward with plans to build private motorways. www.shropshirestar.com/news/2010 ... e-failure/ www.publicservice.co.uk/news_story.asp?id=14002 www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/new ... laims.html The only way the government would get private companies interested in toll roads is if they cannibalised the existing motorway network, and gave lanes over to private operators. This would result in increased congestion as you would then end up with an empty outside lane used only by Nigel and Jeremys in their Porshe's and BMW's, while everyone else, including lorry drivers would have to crawl along the remaining two lanes.

What they should do with motorways is ban freight traffic. That should be kept to the rail network and that should be upgraded.

Quote ="The Chair Maker"George Osborne is looking for private firms to run segregated toll road sections on our motorways. Creating a two tier network were the rich will be able to zoom up and down the country in their Mercedes and BMW's while the average family will be stuck in traffic jams. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ds-newsxml The longer this government goes on the more we see the way thy view the world. Its not about bringing everyone together as a nation its about THEM and US.'" Works in France, Germany, Italy....................

Quote ="The Chair Maker"George Osborne is looking for private firms to run segregated toll road sections on our motorways. Creating a two tier network were the rich will be able to zoom up and down the country in their Mercedes and BMW's while the average family will be stuck in traffic jams. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ds-newsxml The longer this government goes on the more we see the way thy view the world. Its not about bringing everyone together as a nation its about THEM and US.'" Works in France, Germany, Italy....................

It's going to be a heck of an upgrade, and you'll have to move all the shops to be next to the railway stations.

I've clearly got this all wrong, I thought that as time moved on the idea was to improve things for people not make everything cost more and be worse.

Go on then, which autobahns, autoroutes and autostradas have separate toll lanes for express traffic?

Or are you talking about full toll-routes? If so, then the M6 toll is a prime example of how that works over here. You could hold a banquet across it on most days

full toll routes, and the M6 isn't used because there is a free alternative that runs practically alongside it, in France there rarely is a viable alternative to the toll routes.

it would also be better for freight, take some duty off fuel but add tolls, then the HGV drivers would be on an even playing field with everyone else.

Right, so they haven't got the dog's breakfast that Gideon is suggesting then?

So it doesn't work in the other countries you mention because they haven't got anything comparable?

Germany has no toll roads. They have a system which collects tolls for freight traffic only via a camera system, but ordinary traffic travels toll-free.

The systems in France and Italy do not use a single 'express lane' available only to those who can pay. As coddy says, take a look at the M6 Toll to see how well a French or Italian system would work over here.

Have you ever seen a congestion map for the railways?

The M6 toll isn't used because its cost now outweighs its benefits, also any new toll road is going to find free alternative routes close by, we are not a huge country after all.

No it doesn't. They have signs saying "M6 Toll Clear" but nothing to say whether the M6 is clear or not. You are unable to make an informed choice - it's just another example of rip-off Britain. Now, if they had a sign saying both stretches were clear how many would use the Toll road?

It's the same in Europe. One minute you're on a busy motorway, next minute you're on a beautiful new road with no one else on it for miles. At that point you realise you're on a Toll motorway and you've missed the sign!

Thought we already paid a toll for all of our roads, Car Tax.

and car tax is totally unfair, road tax and third party insurance should be levvied on fuel, much fairer.

Nowadays that would suit me down to the ground. Not too sure if the hauliers would agree though.

The fact that construction companies are begging for some sort of kick start to the housing market and government guarantees for first time mortgagees is an indicator of just how much spare cash those national (and often international) construction companies have to throw around on projects that have already been proven to fail.

The cash for housing on the other hand already has a successful model to follow from '08 to '10 when the government backed house purchase share scheme was in place, it was actually a boom time for builders when first time buyers could get onto the mortgage treadmill, its no coincidence that the sector has crashed again as soon as the scheme was withdrawn.

That's what happens when you let the markets decide. The coalition ended the house-share scheme and suddenly there was buggerall demand, so instead of admitting they'd ballsed up, they come up with another scheme to try to stimulate the market but it's not a 'U' turn. Oh no.

When the second bridge crossing of the Mersey is complete that will be a toll bridge and they are going to make the existing Runcorn / Widnes bridge a toll bridge as well so there isn't a free alternative.

This has gone down like a lead balloon with the locals because Runcorn and Widnes were made into Halton development zone and as a result a lot of development work was done but most of it on the Widnes side of the bridge. So the Runcorn population who regularly travel across the bridge to use the huge Tesco and other shops, go to the multiplex cinema over there or just to enjoy the redeveloped waterfront suddenly face paying tolls to do so. These clearly were not part of the plan when the Halton development was envisaged.

The Runcorn locals campaigned for passes for free use of the Bridge on the basis that it was their council taxes that went to fund the Halton development and now they were going to be penalised when wanting to access it but were refused. They will get a discount instead but its probably still going to reduce the local traffic and affect the businesses in Widnes.

A fine example of British coordinated planning for you!

To compare the continent and their toll roads to here is barmy. The UK is a compact densly populated country when compared to the likes of France, Spain and Germany. The toll roads work in Europe and are well used especially given the distances you might want to cover. How long would it take to get from Paris to Lyon on a non toll road!!

Most continentals travelling between big cities, especially the French & Germans would opt for TGV or similar, rather than bugger around on the roads

And the train services are cheaper too. And a proper network, so if you are on a train that's delayed, any connection will be held for you.

I can't ever remember having to stand on a continental train either.

It amazes me that airlines allocate seating, as do inter-city coaches and yet the railways can hide behind victorian legislation, in order to continue treating their passengers worse than livestock

I have had to stand a couple of times in France – but only on very small, local trains.

Train travel in the UK can be a nightmare. There really are times I've flashed the press card.

Mind, talking of travel companies – I had fun with BA at the weekend, getting trapped in Glasgow because of fog in London. Now I don't have an issue with them not taking risks, but the lack of proper information – partly to keep you in the loop with them and to stop them incurring any more costs – is frustrating, to say the least.